Scalzi

There's already case law on these sorts of shenanigans: Midler v. Ford Motor Co., so Altman was either ignorant of this, in which case OpenAI needs new counsel, or he knew and did it anyway, because fuck you Scarlett Johannson. I'm pretty sure it's the latter.

https://gizmodo.com/openai-pausing-chatgpt-4o-scarlett-johansson-voice-1851488261

OpenAI Will Ditch ChatGPT's Scarlett Johansson-Like Voice: Report

ChatGPT-4o's "Sky" voice belongs to a different actress and is not meant to be an imitation, OpenAI said

Gizmodo
May 21, 2024 at 11:53amWeb
Show threadKofi Loves Efia May 21, 2024
@scalzi Large Language models, like silicon valley ideas, depend on IP theft for their very existence, he didn't think I would be any different stealing from someone well know
Show threadFeralRobotsMay 21, 2024
@Seruko @scalzi
The flow of it all was weird, though. First OpenAI negotiates for months for the legal right to use her voice. That fails when she says 'no.'
Then he personally messages her, asking to re-open the negotiations, just a day or two before they start publicly using her voice.
That second part is what's bugging me. Is it him thinking 'uh-oh I screwed up we need to nail this down'? Is it his counsel telling him something like that? or is it some kind of weird attempt at intimidation?
Show threadKofi Loves Efia May 21, 2024

@FeralRobots

Shock at being told no.

Show threadFeralRobotsMay 21, 2024
@scalzi for some reason it's making me think of how he controlled his sister Annie by locking up her inheritance. I suspect he has an ingrained notion that he can make troublesome women - or maybe just troublesome people in general - go away by throwing enough resources at them.
Show threadEric A. MeyerMay 21, 2024
@scalzi Which is, you have to admit, painfully on-brand for OpenAI (and Altman).
Show threadBrian MacDonaldMay 21, 2024
@Meyerweb @scalzi Strikes me as pretty typical tech-bro "Act first, ask permission later" with the assumption that whatever you're doing is so cool or influential that whoever you need to ask permission of will either happily grant it (once they know how cool you are) or will be forced to grant it by societal pressure. I imagine this tactic has a high failure rate, but tech-bros never worry about that.
Show threadTaran RampersadMay 22, 2024

@bmac @Meyerweb @scalzi Tech-bros are typically more interested in a chance at success than worry about the looming failures. It's in all their books.

It's also conceptually the same way spam companies work. They're waiting for those hundred suckers in a million to click that link....

Spam-bros.

Show threadBrother Holmes May 21, 2024
@scalzi Wow, I just found out about this. AI is such a crappy business dealing. The entire industry is based on stealing anything of value (art, literature, likeness, etc.) & calling it a revolutionary product.
I hope that her lawyers sue & win big so that this whole industry thinks twice about how they move forward.
Show threadEricMay 21, 2024
@scalzi when I heard this morning I thought- you messed with the wrong person! Johanson wasn't afraid to take on Marvel/Disney. What makes you (open ai) think she would not fight you?
Show threadAriadne BlasterboltMay 21, 2024
@djotaku @scalzi
Of all the actresses to pick…so I assume they’re trying for an inverted Streisand effect. They have so much money they can weather any outcome. Pay Johansson? Sure, that’s what they’re trying to do anyhow. Penalties? These companies are so rich that penalties are insignificant. Stop using the voice? Sure, but look at the marketing bump. Or the court upends precedent and they win.
Show threadottoMay 21, 2024
@scalzi Johannson is famous but with 8 billion of us on this planet, is it even POSSIBLE to synthesize a voice that sounds human [desired feature] but does not sound like any one person [apparently NOT desired]?
Show threadAdam LaMoreMay 21, 2024
@ottomate @scalzi It should be relatively easy to synthesize a voice that doesn't sound like the celebrity that they were in failed negotiations with to use their voice rights, who also voiced an AI in a well-known film. With anyone else they would have had plausible deniability.
Show threadFeralRobotsMay 21, 2024
@ottomate @scalzi I do not have the opportunity to sell my voice for millions of dollars. She does. It may sound shitty but that gives her a legal case I would not have.
Show threadSteve VladMay 21, 2024
@scalzi All I can say is, Don’t mess with Scarlett. You’ll lose.
Show threadRide TheoryMay 21, 2024

@scalzi

Also, Tom Waits vs Frito-Lay

https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/79648/when-tom-waits-sued-frito-lay-over-doritos-ad

When Tom Waits Sued Frito-Lay Over a Doritos Ad | Mental Floss

“There's a new tortilla chip called SalsaRio Doritos," Crooned the Waits impersonator. "It's buffo, boffo, bravo, gung-ho, tallyho but never mellow.”

Mental Floss
Show threadSteinar BangMay 21, 2024

@scalzi Yeah!

"Different actress",... likely... not!

Show threadJoseph ShoerMay 21, 2024
@scalzi Besides the general entitlement and skeeviness here, I can't get over how the inciting incident here is so completely a retelling of the Torment Nexus. ("We wanted the same voice as in a movie about the perils of interacting with AI.")
Show threadNoah CookMay 21, 2024

@scalzi I have friends who've done acting gigs, including voice acting. They've always been eager to share stuff they've done like candy commercials and such. Actors almost never sign NDAs because it's literally anti-networking.

So the claim that they're keeping the names of the voice actors secret doesn't pass the smell test. They may as well have said "she's from Canada".

Show threadLazarou Monkey Terror 🚀💙🌈May 21, 2024
@scalzi that man's reign of chaos needs to end
Show threadTom BortelsMay 21, 2024

@scalzi

Thing is... the Midler case was not just voice, but appearance and mannerisms and voice. Presumably the OpenAI case is just the voice and maybe inflection?

Yes, OpenAI is skeevy, and clearly trained on her voice without permission, and for that needs to be punished. Granted. But it raises a question: do we live in a world where fame is first-come-first-served, and if you are born with some strong resemblance to a famous person you're now precluded from becoming famous for fear of being sued?

If OpenAI found a voice actress that naturally sounded very similar to Scarlett (or Earl or Obama or whoever)- is that voice actress precluded from doing professional work, by virtue of not being famous yet - because the result could be mistaken for a prior famous person? How long does that last? Rich Little made a career out of impersonating other celebrities - how was that different?

Show threadQ.H. StoneMay 21, 2024
@scalzi Tech bros always think they're special and rules don't apply to them.
Show threadDavid CohenMay 21, 2024
@scalzi So glad these amoral, arrogant techbros are in charge of developing technology that looks to insert itself deep into our lives. What could possibly go wrong with that?
Show threadansible42May 21, 2024
@scalzi it's like if they are breaking the law with new tech that seems incomprehensible it's OK.
Show threadDaisy Bateman/Stacie GreyMay 21, 2024
@scalzi this guy has an interesting relationship with the idea of consent, doesn't he?
Show threadThe DoctorMay 30, 2024
@scalzi Pretty on-brand for Sam.