RobohoboFeb 10, 2024
Daniel
This passage from @debcha's "How Infrastructure works" is such a truth that often gets forgotten or ignored on the hunt for profit. It's a very familiar and recurring theme in resilience engineering texts and research. And it also rings true for me in this current trend of continuous layoffs that take more and more slack and capacity out of tech systems being maintained (in addition to the human cost) as remaining humans need to do more work in the same amount of time.
Jan 30, 2024 at 8:56amWeb
Show threadDeb ChachraJan 30, 2024
@mrtazz thank you for reading and for sharing — I’m glad to hear this resonates with you!
Show threadJohn GordonJan 30, 2024

@mrtazz @asociologist @debcha “Making systems resilient is fundamentally at odds with optimization, because optimizing a system means taking out any slack. A truly optimized, and thus efficient, system is only possible with near-perfect…”

Sing it friend.

America works too hard.

Show threadJohanna RothmanJan 30, 2024
@jgordon @mrtazz @asociologist @debcha The more management focuses on efficiency (often by person, not focused on one overarching goal) the less innovation anyone can create.
We apply the reasoning of manufacturing efficiency, where it might be a Good Idea under certain circumstances, to knowledge work, where it is a terrible idea.
Show threadGBlishenJan 30, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha seems we quickly fall into this inflexible pattern which creates a human problem. It is almost habitual the problems we create.
Show threadXenofact (he/him)Jan 30, 2024
@tinfoiling @mrtazz @debcha seeking profit always involves optimization. Meaning it will produce less resilience.
Show threadJan DJan 30, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha might work well with Tsing’s "On Nonscalability"
Show threadAnnieJan 30, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha This strikes me as applicable to all living/physical systems. I could just as easily map this sentiment to educational pedagogy, philosophical explorations in self-discovery, the solar system, or local public transit.
Show threadDeb ChachraJan 30, 2024
@mrtazz @anne Indeed. https://mastodon.social/@debcha/111845210054625438
Show threadJeroen van BergenFeb 1, 2024
@anne @mrtazz @debcha True, one of my initial thoughts was how this applies to world class athletes. They have a single, well defined goal and try to get rid of everything blocking them from reaching that goal. Failure is a likely outcome for them.
Show thread➴➴➴Æ🜔Ɲ.Ƈꭚ⍴𝔥єɼ👩🏻‍💻Jan 30, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha This feels like a super-specific definition of efficient/optimized.
Efficient means optimized for a particular cost-function. The reason an efficient system gets rid of those things is because they aren't valued.
So, why do we have a system that doesn't value them?
Show threadThe Baltimore AnalystJan 30, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha Wow never thought of phrasing it this way. I have a friend who is obsessed with maximizing efficiency, definitely plan on using this talking point.
Show threadSteve GisselbrechtJan 30, 2024

@mrtazz @debcha

I TRY to never wish anyone ill, I really do, but there is a part of me that hopes that every "just in time" management consultant and "lean manufacturing" efficiency expert fails to get some vital medical treatment because of a supply chain problem that they helped to cause.

Show threadEdmund LauterbachJan 30, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha
I think it's a question of defining efficiency. If you want a system to be resilient, you need to factor resilience into your optimization and give failures a strong negative rating.
Show threadas the _cr0_tabsFeb 5, 2024
@elba013 @mrtazz @[email protected] the typical response to that tactic is to externalize risk past the horizon of either feedback or accountability.
Show threadAndrocatJan 30, 2024

@mrtazz

This is also true of any significant job role in any organization.

If your fire department is optimized, you are not ready for any fires at all.

Having some slack is the same as having some readiness.

@debcha

Show threadrat (mibioctet)Jan 30, 2024

@mrtazz @debcha IMO this is the core problem rotting away the software industry from the inside.

We're so far up the abstraction tree that I'm not sure that many people have the slightest clue what's more than a few levels down. The system is inherently *un*knowable and this leads to very bad systems built on very bad systems built on very bad systems built on--

Show threadGarrett LatimerJan 30, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha one could argue this applies to society as a whole. It’s a system too.
Show threadViolet MadderJan 30, 2024

@mrtazz @debcha

It ain't very fuckin optimized after it fails to handle a crisis and implodes, now is it?

Show threadnonlinearJan 31, 2024

@mrtazz @debcha yup, efficiency reduces redundancy. redundancy is diversity and a diverse ecology is a healthy ecology.

less redundancy means more vulnerability.

you can say efficiency is optimizing for one risk to the detriment of all others.

not smart in the long run. but who's thinking in more than 6-month increments nowadays?

Show threadHelen LHJan 31, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha
Exactly! Efficient is not the same as effective (reliable). It bothers me that managers prefer efficient but ineffective systems.
Show threadGraniteGeekJan 31, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha Celebrating an inefficient way to help people with energy efficiency: https://granitegeek.concordmonitor.com/2023/10/25/hooray-for-a-really-inefficient-way-to-reduce-peoples-energy-use/
Hooray for a really inefficient way to reduce people’s energy use - Granite Geek

The couch in my living room is against an outside wall, right under a window. I have spent three decades trying to eliminate the draft against the back of my neck when I sit there. WindowDressers might have an answer. Better than that: They go about it in an interesting, if inefficient, manner. The volunteer-based […]

Granite Geek
Show threadÐДѷє ۷ǿȵ ຣJan 31, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha placed it on the ‘to order’ list!
Show threadRachel A. RosenFeb 4, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha I think about this a lot in education. There's no redundancy built into staffing, and every time this turns out to have been a mistake, people act very panicked.
Show threadSanjoFeb 4, 2024
@mrtazz such an excellent book that I thoroughly enjoyed, beginning to end - especially the end!
Show threadDieuFeb 4, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha Taleb makes very similar points in "The Black Swan". I guess it takes a lot of effort to ignore all that, and a lot of confidence that nobody knows how to build a guillotine anymore.
Show threadFlowChainSenseiFeb 4, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha Aka queueing theory
Show threadCat HicksFeb 4, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha really profound point about psychological needs as well truly
Show threadCraig EliasonFeb 4, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha Reminded me of this informative piece on rail from a couple years ago: https://www.propublica.org/article/train-derailment-long-trains
The True Dangers of Long Trains

Trains are getting longer. Railroads are getting richer. But these “monster trains” are jumping off of tracks across America and regulators are doing little to curb the risk.

ProPublica
Show threadThorne LawlerFeb 4, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha @verdigriis There’s a very similar point to be made about security. A thing can be as easy to use as possible, or it can be secure. The thing which is as secure as possible is inherently the thing which cannot be used.
If you have found a way to remove any security-related impediment then you have bypassed security.
Show threadDave Lane  🇳🇿Feb 5, 2024
@mrtazz a useful insight of which to remind us all! @debcha
Show threadadamriceFeb 5, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha This resonates a lot with the reasons behind the railroad workers strike last year.
Show threadOliver JensenFeb 5, 2024

@mrtazz @debcha

> For a system to be reliable, on the other hand, there have to be some unused resources to draw on when the unexpected happens.

I have been saved *multiple* times by having "pipe 5 gigs of /dev/zero into a file" be part of my standard setup on any important bare-metal systems, so when everything is burning because something unexpectedly ate all your disk space you can just delete the file and immediately have breathing room.

Show threadAlerta! Alerta!Feb 17, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha Not only tech systems. Transport, Health care, You name it...
Show threadBruno BaketarićMay 29, 2024

@mrtazz @debcha

vague risk vs. concrete cost.

Guess who will win this fight, given executives tendency to satisfy short term shareholer value?

🤦

Show threadPhil Thane ✅May 30, 2024
@mrtazz
The UK health service needs to learn this. It runs at near capacity in the summer and is then overwhelmed every winter.
@debcha
Show threadpa28May 30, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha managers who pursue these policies should be made to take transoceanic flights in single engine airplanes. After all they would be much more efficient and only a few percentage points more dangerous.
Show threadCecilia TanAug 12, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha My partner corwin is reading that book right now! (And loving it.)
Show threadKevin RiggleAug 13, 2024
@mrtazz @debcha everything is too efficient and it’s exhausting