3d modeling for printing

https://lemmy.world/post/8489480

3d modeling for printing - Lemmy.World

I’ve never used a 3d printer before but want to get one. I have a bit experience in blender but not too much. My question is: How do you model for a 3d print? For example, if I want to print a hollow cylinder, I go into blender, create cylinder and delete the side faces. If I print this, the walls will be pretty thin. Do I have to make them bigger manually? and if I do so (extrude and scale) does my slicer (cura) automatically fill in the solid part?

First off I’ll say that what programs you’d want to use depend on what kind of things you’re wanting to design. If you’re wanting to design something artistic (a sculpture or miniature or model of a space ship or whatever), Blender’s a great choice. If you’re wanting to design something that’s more for mechanical use (a custom wall mount for something, a replacement gear for machinery, a case for a Raspberry Pi, whatever), you’ll probably be better served using a CAD (Computer-Aided Design) program like TinkerCAD, FreeCAD, AutoCAD, or OpenSCAD.

I do a lot of CAD sort of model designs and I personally love OpenSCAD, but it’s made very particularly for programmers. TinkerCAD has a much lower learning curve and is free to use.

I don’t do much artistic model designing for 3d printing. I dabble in Blender too, but mostly just to make minor tweaks to models I found online.

About your cylinder question, you’re right that any slicer would be pretty confused if you gave it a shape like that. To make it work, you’d need a shape that had volume. Not something that’s an infinitely thin surface.

To get a “tube,” you’d have to decide how thick you want the walls and deal with that in whatever program you’re using to make the 3d model. In a CAD program, the way you’d think about this is that you’d add a cylinder and then “subtract” another (concentric) cylinder with a smaller radius. Like, if you wanted a cylinder with an outer diameter of 3cm and a thickness of 2mm, you’d make a 3cm cylinder and “subtract” from that cylinder another cylinder with a diameter of 3 centimeters minus twice 2 millimeters or 2.6 cm. (The second cylinder would also need to be of equal or greater height than the first.)

The result would be an object with volume and with a very specific defined thickness that your slicer would be able to handle nicely.

Where CAD programs let you think in terms of “volumes” of various shapes and combining them in interesting ways, programs like Blender work more in terms of “polygons.” I’m not terribly familiar with Blender, but just off the top of my head, if I were trying to do the same thing in Blender, I might make a cylinder 3cm in diameter, another one 2.6cm in diameter (at the same location with the same height), remove the top and bottom faces of both cylinders, reverse the normals on all faces of the second cylinder, and then manually, one by one, create faces to fill in the “ring” around the top and the “ring” around the bottom.

Does that all make sense?

So it will ultimately come down to what file format you need for the 3D printer and if Blender can support that. Otherwise, you may need to generate your geometry using a CAD program.

Regardless, you will need to generate the solid model of your cylinder. In this case you’d extrude your cylinder surface to create a volume body and not a sheet or surface.

That is a weird take. File format is completely irrelevant here. 3D printers usually only accept G-code files, or something similar, which is unrelated to the file format used for the model. You can also easily convert pretty much anything to something your slicer will accept.

Hello! I’m on mobile and bad at organizing my thoughts, but I thought I’d attempt to tackle some of this.

You can experiment with different types of models and bring them into Cura to see what the results will be yourself, but typically your focus should be on creating “water tight” meshes, where the normals of all polygons face outwardly from the mesh and there are no deleted faces or holes between them.

Individual polygons don’t have any thickness on their own, so if you delete faces on a primitive cylinder and bring it into Cura, when slicing it will attempt to “close” the hole left behind in order to make the mesh water-tight.

So, say you wanted to make a cup. You generate a cylinder in Blender of the right size, then delete the faces on one of the caps to create a cup-like shape. When you bring this object into Cura, it will not be able to see the back faces of the polygons inside of the cup, because it’s reading the normals on the outside of the cup for those polygons. They can’t serve as both the inside and outside, and they have no thickness. So, Cura will try to close the hole at the top of the geometry, basically just giving you the cylinder you started with.

You could fix this by just extruding all of the geometry from your cup version of the cylinder, which will create a perimeter of faces on the top edge, and will leave you with inside and outside polygons. That is what Cura will read to create your shell.

On that note, printed models are made up of effectively two components: shell and infill. The Shell is made up of the outermost layers, which are the strongest. The infill is a pattern that supports the interior of meshes. If you printed a sphere, you likely wouldn’t want it to be made of 100% solid plastic because it would be a waste of materials and time. So infill supports the shell with a pattern, kind of like a honeycomb, that is just meant to make sure the inside isn’t empty but is strong enough to withstand some force. On average, this is usually only about 15 to 30% density.

There are many great articles and YouTube videos out there about the process, and I’m sorry that I don’t have anything to point you towards right now. If you have any questions about anything, I’d be happy try to help as best I can.

I mostly use solid basic shapes (like e.g. a cylinder) which I modify using extrude or moving edges/vertices and then combine using the boolean modifier, which can do union, difference and intersection.

Sometimes you have to switch to carve in the modifier to get it to work correctly.

The important thing is to only work with watertight objects. So for your hollow cylinder example I’d do the following:

  • Create a cylinder with the desired outer radius and height.
  • Create a taller cylinder with the radius of hole.
  • Move both onto the same location. The taller cylinder should stick out on bottom and top
  • Select the outer cylinder -> modifiers -> add modifier boolean -> difference to inner cylinder
  • Select the outer cylinder and export it with the option “Export only selection”

If you’re new to 3d printing, I would avoid Blender. It’s too easy to create non-manifold and non-watertight objects with it.

In your example, the walls aren’t thin, they have no thickness whatsoever and would not even appear in your slicer.

I would recommend trying Fusion 360 if you’re not on Linux, openSCAD if you have a basic understanding of coding, or even TinkerCAD (web based) if you’re not making anything too complex. Those are made to create physical objects.

Onshape is also good, the free version has all the functionality you could want unless having private models is important to you
I’ll check it out too!

Fusion360 can run on linux using WINE, HERE is a GitHub repo showing how to set it up.

Or the web version works on linux too ofc

GitHub - cryinkfly/Autodesk-Fusion-360-for-Linux: This is a project, where I give you a way to use Autodesk Fusion 360 on Linux!

This is a project, where I give you a way to use Autodesk Fusion 360 on Linux! - cryinkfly/Autodesk-Fusion-360-for-Linux

GitHub
Good to know! I just saw a post somewhere around here recently by someone who had troubles on Linux, which is what I based this off of (a little hastily).
Ya I don’t doubt people have troubles with it since you need winetricks and such. Hopefully they see that github page eventually and get it working.
NIce! I spent weeks trying to get Fusion 360 to run in wine back in 2020. Eventually I gave up and learned Free CAD/Open scad/blender like all the other penguins.

Start off with Thingiverse or similar. I recommend something like: www.thingiverse.com/thing:3553160 There are a lot of models there - those are .STL that you “slice” and send to your printer. There is this: www.thingiverse.com/thing:2187167 which is CAD models with the working left in - OpenSCAD in this case. You load it up, generate a .STL and then pass that to the slicer.

I have a large plastic cabinet in my garden for storing a lawn mower etc. The hinges died years ago. I have printed new ones. At least 20kg of plastic waste has been avoided being dumped a lot longer. I am well aware (now) that I should not have bought the bloody thing in the first place!

If you go the OpenSCAD route, you might like this: github.com/JustinSDK/dotSCAD - the author sadly passed away recently but his work is legendary in my opinion.

Once you get printing sorted out, then move on to your own stuff. … or not - give it a go! I have a large bag of very strangely shaped PETG experiments that went badly wrong and need recycling.

1-100 Tanks and Vehicles by m_bergman

THE FULL DOWNLOAD IS BROKEN AT THINGIVERSE'S END.UNTIL THEY FIX IT, USE THE INDIVIDUAL ITEM DOWNLOADS.IE Go to the "Thing Files" button and choose from the long list.Since Zip files are now permitted again, I have updated the missing files, and will continue with new stuff. (Files also at wargaming3d.com)This project has now been split into two pieces, because it got too big and broke the site.The yellow photos are also causing problems, so I've added them as a zipped file at the top of the list.The modern vehicles can be found here:https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4718232My definition of Commercial Use is:ADVERTISING MY ITEMS FOR SALEi.e. webshop, ebay, etc.ALL other usage is non-commercial, as far as I'm concerned.Word-of-mouth, requests, 3D hub stuff, all OK, at any quantities.Commercial sales are licensed at 5% of retail price (ex postage, painting/finishing & sales tax). ( I don't believe in profiting from work that isn't my own.)Payments are done monthly through Paypal.100% of license fees are donated by myself to the MS Society of NZ.If you feel the need for a commercial license, please contact me through the private message function here, including your email address.It became obvious that most people are printing my 1:200 tanks for wargaming, so I decided to redetail some of them to suit the scale. A secondary consideration was to ensure that the details would still be printable on my Form 1 SLA printer at 1:200. Since then, it has been by far the most popular scale, and most of my work has been 1:100.These tanks are designed for EXPERTS only. If you don't already know the answer to your questions, please go instead to the 1:200 sets, which are much more forgiving to print. Printed at 0.2mm layers, 0mm support limit, 80degree support angle in ABS on UP plus 2. These models will be added to, on a random schedule.You will find complementary vehicles and guns on TigerAce1945's page (for now):http://www.thingiverse.com/TigerAce1945/designsCurrent vehicle list:Germany:Tiger I midTiger II (P)Tiger II (H)Panther DPanther APanther GJagdpantherJagdpanzer IVJagdpanzer IV L70Pzkpfw 35(t)Pzkpfw 38(t) Ausf APzkpfw 38(t) Ausf B & CPzkpfw 38(t) Ausf DPzkpfw 38(t) Ausf SPzkpfw 38(t) Ausf EPzkpfw 38(t) Ausf FPzkpfw 38(t) Ausf GAufklarer auf Fgst Pzkpfw 38(t)Pzfpkw II L LuchsPzkpfw III LPzkpfw III MPzkpfw III NPzkpfw III flammStug IIIGStuH 42Pzkpfw IV GFerdinandElefantE-100OstwindSturmpanzer IV BrummbarJagdpanzer 38 HetzerFlammpanzer 38Sdkfz 234-1Sdkfz 234-2Sdkfz 234-3Sdkfz 234-4Sdkfz 250/A1Sdkfz 250/A3Sdkfz 250/A5Sdkfz 250/A10Sdkfz 250/B1Sdkfz 250/B8 stummelSdkfz 250/B9Sdkfz 251/D1Sdkfz 251/D1 stuka-zu-fussSdkfz 251/D9 stummelSdkfz 252 Leichter Gepanzerter MunitionskfaftwagenSonder Anhanger 3 1/1 ammunition trailerSdkfz 253 Leichter Gepanzerter BeobachtungskraftwagenSdkfz 2 KettenkraftradSdkfz 7 KM m11Sdkfz 10 ausf BSdkfz 11Sdkfz 11/1 2cm FlaK 37Sdkfz 9 FamoSdkfz 9 Famo with spadeLWS (Landwasserschlepper)Opel MaultierFord V3000 MaultierKubelwagenTrippel SG6/38Trippel SG6/41Horch 108 / 108ASteyr 1500Steyr 1500 KommandeurwagenFord V3000Mercedes L4500SMercedes L4500AMercedes L4500R MaultierMorserzugmittel 35(t)Belehlpanzer 38HMunitionschlepper 38HPzkpfw 38H 735(f)Pzkpfw 38H 735(f) with wurfrahmenPzkpfw 35S 739(f)Pzkpfw B-2 740(f)Flammwagen auf Pzkpfw B-2(f)10.5cm leFH18/3 auf GW B-2(f)Unic U304(f) artillery tractorUnic U304(f) 2cm Flak earlyUnic U304(f) 2cm Flak lateUnic U304(f) Schutzenpanzerwagen lateSdkfz 302 Goliath (electric)Sdkfz 303 Goliath (petrol)Sdkfz 304 Springer20mm Flak 3875mm LeIG-18UK:1914 & 1920 pattern Armoured CarDorchester 4x4 ACV (LP & HP)AEC 6x6 ACV (LP & HP)TetrarchTetrarch CSAlectoM3 Stuart (UK)M3 Stuart HybridM3 Stuart RecceM3A3 StuartM3A3 Stuart RecceCentaurCentaur AACromwellChallengerCometSherman VSherman VC FireflyMatilda II (BEF)Matilda IIMatilda II CSValentine IValentine IIValentine IIIValentine IXValentine XIValentine III BridgelayerChurchill IChurchill I CSChurchill Oke flamethrowerChurchill IIChurchill IIIChurchill III (75mm)Churchill III AVREChurchill IVChurchill IV (75mm)Churchill IV AVREChurchill V (95mm howitzer)Churchill AVRE with fascine and fascine sledChurchill AVRE with SBG bridgeChurchill 3" Gun CarrierBishopArcherSexton IISexton II GPORam II OPUniversal CarrierUniversal Carrier 3" mortar carrierWasp IIWindsor Carrier (6pdr versions)Windsor Carrier (4.2"mortar versions)Bren Carrier No2 Mk1M7 Priest KangarooRam I KangarooRam II KangarooM5 halftrackM9A1 halftrackLVT-4 (armed, armoured)LVT-4 (armed, armoured) with Polsten cannonDaimler Scout Car mk1 DingoDaimler Scout Car mk2 DingoDaimler Scout Car mk3 DingoHumber Mk II armoured carHumber Mk IV armoured carStaghound IStaghound IIStaghound IIIStaghound AAAirborne JeepAirborne Jeep - ReconSAS Jeep - desert (LRDG jeep essentially the same)SAS Jeep - ETOSAS Jeep - ETO armouredAustin 10 HPAustin 10 TilleyAustin K30Austin K2Austin K2Y AmbulanceAustin K3Austin K6Austin K6 Breakdown GantryBedford MWCBedford MWDBedford MWRBedford MWVMorris-Commercial CS8 15cwtFordson WOT2 15cwtLRDG Chevrolet 30cwtLRDG Chevrolet 30cwt with Breda 20mm4.2" mortar trailerX-Craft mini submarineUSA:Holt 75Holt 120Holt 5TM2A4M3 StuartM3A1 StuartM5 StuartM5A1 StuartM4A3M4A3-76M4A3-105M4A3 HVSSM7 Priest (3-piece transmision)M26 PershingM45 Pershing (105mm)LVT-4 (armed, armoured)M3A1 Scout carM20 Command CarJeepJeep with .50cal MGJeep with .30cal MGM4 HST class AM4 HST class BM5 HSTM5A1 HSTWACO Hadrian CG-4Russia:IS-1IS-2IS-2MIS-3T-26AT-26BXT-26T-26-4 76mmT-28T-28 uparmouredT-34-76OT-34-76T-34 85OT-34-85T-70SU-85SU-100SU-122SU-152SU-76SU-76iSU-85bISU-122ISU-122SISU-130ISU-130MISU-152ZSU-37KhTZ-16Na Ispug (Odessa) tankBA-3 armoured carBA-6 armoured carBA-10 armoured carBA-10M armoured carKomintern tractorVoroshilovets tractorSTZ-3STZ-5 tractorB-4 203mm HowitzerM17 halftrackZIS-5ZIS-5-BZ tankerZIS-6ZIS-22 halftrackHungary:Toldi IToldi IIaNimrod ( & L62)Turan ITuran IITuran IIIZrinyi IICsaba Armoured CarAnsaldo 35MAnsaldo 35M commandRaba Botond IRaba Botond IIItaly:Autocarro S-37 ProtettoCV-33 serie ICV-33 serie IICV-33 with 20mm cannonCV-35CV-35 with 20mm cannonCV-35 Lance-flammeCV-35 mod (L3/38)M15-42M15-42 Centro RadioM42 Carro CommandoM42 Semovente 75 L18M42 Semovente 75 L34Autoproletta LinceBreda-35 20mm AACannone da 47/32IranPraga AH-IVRomania:R1R2TACAM R2Bulgaria:T-11Japan:Chi-HaShinhoto Chi-HaHo-NiHo-RoShi-KiType 95 Kurogane mk3Type 95 Kurogane mk5 pickupFrance:Hotchkiss H35Hotchkiss H38Hotchkiss H39Somua S35Somua SAu40Char B1Char B1 bisLorraine 37LLorraine 37L shortLorraine 38L VBCPUnic P107 EngineerUnic P107 ArtilleryUnic P107 AFNNew Zealand:Bob Semple Tractor TankBeaverette Mk2NZ Pattern Wheeled Carrier Mk2Bren Carrier LP1Bren Carrier LP2Staghound I (NZ)Staghound II (NZ)Stuart HybridAustralia:Matilda II (Aus)Matilda II CS (Aus)Matilda II FrogSouth Africa:Marmon Herrington Armoured Car Mk IMarmon Herrington Armoured Car Mk II MFFMarmon Herrington Armoured Car Mk II MECanadaRam IRam I KangarooRam IIRam II KangarooRam II OPBadger FlamethrowerWasp IIcSexton IISexton II GPOFox armoured carChevrolet 1533x2 30cwt GS truckChevrolet 1543x2 3T GS truckCMP C15A-GS 15cwt truckCMP F15A-GS 15cwt truckCMP C60L-GS 3t truckCMP F60L-GS 3t truckCMP C60L-AMB AmbulanceCMP F60L-AMB AmbulanceCMP C60L-M-GAS Petrol TankerCMP C60L-WATER Water TankerCMP F60L-WATER Water TankerCMP C60L-Command HP & LPSwedenStrv m/37

Thingiverse
Watch some freecad tutorials
In the case of a hollow cylinder this is something a slicer can handle from a full cylinder model. Remove the infill (inside of the cylinder) and top fill. As for software it depends what you want to create, blender is great for artistic work. For mechanical assemblies I’d throw in onshape with the other suggestions.

Google for TinkerCad to see an amazingly easy modeling tool. Put shapes together, and set some of the shapes to be a hole (negative shape).

It’s incredibly easy to make useful things.

I just made a Dremel safety jig in tinkercad for work. Fairly simple to work with and it'll get the job done for sure, but editing parts later can be a bit of a pain
i use openscad, for simple stuff is very efficient even without knowing much
  • Learn basic freecad
  • Learn basic openscad
  • Learn how to use openscad in freecad
  • Iterate
  • Side note, freecad is CPU bound, so use a good CPU.

    If you are willing to pay the price, you can try Moment Of Invention. It has also a fully functional time limited demo. I worked with the demo and, while for now I use Freecad, I must admit that it is pretty good
    I believe you’re referring to Moment of Inspiration, or MoI 3D.
    Yep, that one. Not checked the name 😬

    To answer your question (and not just recommend another piece of software instead):

    Making a cylinder and deleting the cap faces makes what’s known as a non-manifold mesh. To my knowledge this means you can see the backfaces without travelling through any existing faces (in your case, you can see them by looking through the holes you made when you deleted the cap faces).
    That cylinder has walls that are theoretically infinitely thin, so you should thicken them up before attempting to print it. You can do this with a Solidify modifier. You can also extrude and scale them if you like, it achieves the same effect.

    Given a manifold mesh, your slicer will treat the inside (as in, the direction the backfaces are pointing) as solid, and you can change the density and infill pattern to whatever you like.

    Make a few of these shapes, both manifold and non-manifold, and see how your slicer reacts when you tell it to slice them.