Robert CarnelOct 13, 2023
@tatooka in Dying Sun how do you handle Disaster and Setback in situations where narratively the situation is a ranged attack against an opponent that has no ranged capability. There's improvised weapons and hidden daggers or darts but curious if there is anything more elegant that you use?
Show threadTaTooKa Oct 16, 2023
@carnel hi there!
First I would think of costs and risks. In the situation you are describing (a ranged attack against an opponent who can't respond in kind), there seems to be no risk. As per the 24XX rules, no dice roll would be necessary, hence no disaster/setback.
The GM could impose a cost though: maybe make them spend ammo or tell them the requirements are to put themselves in a dangerous situation (something like positioning themselves too close to other enemies, or revealing themselves)
Show threadTaTooKa 
@carnel the takeaway here is that not all actions require a dice roll. In 24XX, only when there's a risk are players required to roll the dice. If you can't think of a risk in that situation, just tell them that
a) it's possible, and it just happens,
b) it's possible but requires some sort of cost or puts them in danger,
or
c) It's impossible, for some reason.
Oct 16, 2023 at 12:02amWeb
Show threadTaTooKa Oct 16, 2023
@carnel what does that mean for a ranged attack? well, maybe the character just lands a hit, which could defeat the opponent, or weaken him, take their attention away from an ally, etc. There's no Hit Points in 24XX, so it doesn't matter "how much damage" you do. Everything needs to be thought in narrative terms.
Show threadTaTooKa Oct 16, 2023
@carnel Having said that, I understand the urge to not allow a ranged attack to just be a free way to dispose of enemies. If you want to have them roll, you need to impose a risk, though.
I wouldn't go so far as to say they are "risking death" (in fact, I would rule that ranged attacks have the benefit of being "safer" than melee).
To think of a risk for ranged attacks, I would take a page from Dungeon World or other PbtA games (see the Volley Move: https://a-dungeon-world.fandom.com/wiki/Volley) ...
Volley

When you take aim and shoot at an enemy at range, roll+Dex. On a 10+, you have a clear shot—deal your damage . On a 7–9, choose one (whichever you choose you deal your damage): You have to move to get the shot placing you in danger as described by the GM You have to take what you can get: -1d6 damage You have to take several shots, reducing your ammo by one Volley covers the entire act of drawing, aiming, and firing a ranged weapon or throwing a thrown weapon. The advantage to using a ranged wea

A Dungeon World Wiki
Show threadTaTooKa Oct 16, 2023
@carnel Using that as a guideline, I would tell the player that the risk for their ranged attack is that they would reveal their position and/or "aggro" the enemies if they get a Setback, and that their weapon might break (using the MATERIAL rules from DYING SUN) or something worse on a Disaster result.
Show threadTaTooKa Oct 16, 2023

@carnel another way of thinking of this is to make the roll mean "are you accurate enough to hit the target?", which honestly is not very 24XX like, but you could come up with some meaningful risk depending on the context of your fiction:

For example, if there are innocent bystanders nearby, missing the intended target might mean hitting them as collateral.

Or, imagine a stealthy situation: missing the guard might mean that you don't kill them outright, instead alerting them of your presence.

Show threadTaTooKa Oct 16, 2023

@carnel basically what I'm saying is (and this applies to ANY action in 24XX):

If you can't think of a risk for the indended action, there is no dice roll.
The action might automatically succeed/fail, and/or impose a cost or consequence.

For further reading, I would recommend the 2400 EMERGENCY RULES by @JasonT here
https://jasontocci.itch.io/2400

2400 by Jason Tocci

Lo-fi sci-fi micro RPG collection

itch.io
Show threadTaTooKa Oct 16, 2023

@carnel coming back to your original question, in DYING SUN it's easy to say that they risk spending too much ammo on a Setback (a bag costs 1◈, making them buy more-- or craft more by gathering materials),
or that their weapon might break on a Disaster (or on a Setback too, if their ranged weapon is of low quality).

...But I would consider other options based on the context as written above.

Let me know how it goes if you play #24XX #DYINGSUN ! <3

https://tatooka.itch.io/24xx-dying-sun

24XX: DYING SUN by TaTooKa

24XX compatible post-apocalyptic fantasy TTRPG

itch.io
Show threadJasonTOct 16, 2023

@carnel I’m glad @tatooka had the stamina to give a full answer. I’m still drinking my coffee and stuck on, “well, it depends.” 😆

I guess my short summary is: Ask yourself what the worst case scenario is in this situation, and that’s the result on a 1-2. Backtrack from that as needed for the 3-4 result. Like…

(1-2) Miss and give away your position, requiring you to move before you get another shot off, or (3-4) hit, but still give away your position and need to move.

Show threadJasonTOct 16, 2023
@tatooka @carnel oh also, this might be handy https://pretendo.games/2020/11/24/combat-in-24xx/
Combat in 24XX

If your experience with RPGs comes mostly from D&D, I can imagine you might be a little confused upon reading 2400, the 24XX SRD, or any of various 24XX RPGs by others. While I hope that GMs wi…

Pretendo Games
Show threadJasonTOct 16, 2023
@carnel @tatooka (I usually think “you miss” is a boring risk to roll against, though, so season to taste)
Show threadRobert CarnelOct 16, 2023
@JasonT @tatooka yes I agree part of what I enjoyed in th'e game is having combat that is closer to the fiction rather than AD&D's "you miss, I miss". It took the players a bit to realise that they needed to initiate the action rather than trying to defend themselves.
Show threadRobert CarnelOct 16, 2023
@tatooka the first game has gone really well and eager to give it another go. At the moment I'm playing and pitching one-shot games but it would be interesting to go back to the original scenarios and try something like Dune Trader