As an owner of children, I approve this message

https://lemmy.ml/post/3452742

As an owner of children, I approve this message - Lemmy

Carry ons should be put in the overhead bin or tuck under your seat.

If you carry your baby onto the plane, be kind to your fellow passengers and put it in the bin.

Okay, I’m gonna bite the bullet and say it. This is disheartening. I’m not one to clutch pearls, but come on. Would you say this about anyone else? Dogs? Cats? Anything at all? Do you understand how fucked up it is? I just don’t get it. It was the same in Reddit, and it’s fucking same in here. Why do you hate children? You don’t wanna have them, that’s fine. Why would you say these things?

Maybe you’re joking. Even after assuming that you are, this is in poor taste and a fucked up thing to say.

U don't hate children but what i hate is that one child with shitty parents will ruin the entire flight for everyone else.

Do shitty parents and upset children exist? Absolutely.

Yet everyone seems to ignore that maybe, just maybe, that child is being ā€œshittyā€ despite having good parents.

Maybe the kid has a medical issue causing pain and discomfort and there’s not a damn thing the parent can do except get on that flight to see a specialist.

Maybe she’s fleeing domestic violence and needs to get to family to safe.

Maybe the mother has postpartum depression and unfortunately cannot properly care for her child so she’s seeking help elsewhere.

Fuck maybe the kid has an undiagnosed brain tumour that’s going to kill them. I know people that happened to.

If you go around assuming everyone else who inconveniences you in the slightest is a shit person, you will be a shit person.

So get over yourself. You might have a slightly less comfortable flight while that poor parent might be going through the worst time in their life.

See, here’s the neat thing about things. You get to choose what you do and don’t care about. Empathy should not go so far as to cost. Your baby is not my problem and it’s your responsibility to keep it that way. I have my own, I didn’t take them to public places till they were able to have some self control. Is that always possible? No, but it’s really obvious if you are the type of person who doesn’t even try.

Part of using public transport is that you need to share it with the public, which is why I broadly detest it and cannot comprehend the fuck cars weirdos.

That said when I do use public transport I fully expect noisy children, insufferable karens and the occasional nut job.

Your concept of empathy seems to be severely lacking.

Part of using public transport is that you need to share it with the public, which is why I broadly detest it and cannot comprehend the fuck cars weirdos.

Couldn’t agree more. The anti car movement among young millennials and Gen Z is weird as hell to me. I’ve lived in a large city and taken well designed public transit for years. Compared to living in a small city and driving, it’s awful - so I left. There’s a literal loss of freedom and autonomy that comes with it, and I can’t fathom why the younger crowd wants to live in crowded apartments and post angry screeds to r/fuckcars.

If you live in NA, you haven’t lived in a walkable city designed for people over cars. You can find clearer explanations of the rationale from Strong Towns or NotJustBikes.

I’m reluctant to litigate something unpopular on the internet for the purpose of collecting downvotes, and I think there’s low probability we’ll agree on the issue, but I’ll explain my rationale:

I lived in NYC. NYC is not exactly designed for walking or bikes, but there’s a strong case to be made that it has become a city in which cars are much less feasible than transit, walking, or biking. The sidewalks are all double-wide. If you order take-out, the delivery guy is on a bike. Nobody I knew owned a car, and none of us would have been able to afford the parking if we had. We walked to get groceries. The subways run 24/7/365. In terms of density, NYC should be a best-case scenario for public transit.

The fact remains that if you wanted to LEAVE the city and go somewhere green with the ability to get away from people, it was 3x as long by public transit than it would have been by car. Minimum. And those places are far away. It’s a place designed to keep you there. And that’s just my point: I don’t want to feel like a sardine in a city packed with people, I want to get out into nature where I can be the only person for miles around.

This is probably impossible in the Netherlands, which is 92% urban and has an average population density of 1/2 NYC across the entire country. By comparison, the US is 0.6% as densely populated as the Netherlands.

Amsterdam is the city I see cited most often as being the model for a /c/fuckcars-approved world, but my basic thesis is that living in a place with 13,670 people per square mile, greatly diminished personal space (densified housing), and greatly diminished personal autonomy (the ability to leave), is approximately my definition of urban hell.

I submit that the population density of the Northeast Megalopolis (containing NYC, DC, Boston, Philadelphia, Baltimore) is the stuff of dystopian hellscapes. And while that’s a matter of personal preference, I see a feverish, unrelenting push by the younger generations, who didn’t grow up with cars-as-personal-freedom like the Boomers/GenX/Xennials did. In the US, young Millennials, gen Z, and beyond have decided that ultradense cities are great and cars are evil. I understand how they got to that conclusion, but to me it just looks like Eco-Austerity derived from the lack of liberating personal-vehicular-experiences as a late teen and early adult.

Hell, I believe so much in personal vehicles and the autonomy they enable, I obtained a pilot’s license – something that is overwhelmingly difficult and expensive to do in Europe, but for the time being still remains something you can achieve as a middle-class American in some places.

Single-family homes is a topic for another time, but suffice it to say that it was the yardstick of middle-class wealth in postwar America. And now thanks to perpetually swelling city populations, the younger generations are idolizing what amounts to apartment living. Personally, I couldn’t get away from apartments fast enough once my income allowed it. I still don’t know whether I’ll ever own a house, but if I never share a wall with someone again, it will be too soon. I’m frustrated by this newfound need to do away with the tools of our personal independence, and at some level, I fundamentally can’t understand it.

Netherlands Population (2023) - Worldometer

Population of the Netherlands: current, historical, and projected population, growth rate, immigration, median age, total fertility rate (TFR), population density, urbanization, urban population, country's share of world population, and global rank. Data tables, maps, charts, and live population clock

I expect

noisy children, insufferable karens and the occasional nut job

but that doesn’t mean I have much empathy for them…

Being loud in public imposes a cost on the people around you. In our society parents with babies are generally allowed to impose such a cost, but so are raving lunatics…