DeadWorldPokemon Company "having conversations" about how to ensure game quality with regular releases
Flit 🦊 🔥@DeadWorld I'm hopeful this will have results going forward. I'd imagine something of this sort of quality isn't something Nintendo, etc. would want to have a repeat of, and I certainly wouldn't want to see it again either
FlyboyM619Hopefully something comes from this because it’s a shame the way the games have been lately.
jayAfter the TOTK release, all the amazing mechanics, graphics, and creativity? While I think maybe TOTK is setting new bars, it really shows how much they’ve just churned out the Pokémon games without any thought.
Oh they had thoughts alright… thoughts of money!
I think I read on some Wikipedia page that Pokémon makes a majority of their money off merchandise. I think they can wait 7 years for a new game because someone born last year, may not get a Pokémon game until their 9 and they would miss out on 7 years of merchandising and potentially not capture the audience at all.
I know 9 is pretty young already so let’s say it’s a 7 year old and now they are 14 or whatever.
OberonSwansonThey should also look at the long burning tire fire that is Pokémon Go.
Blame for that lies mostly with Niantic. They do the development and pay for the rights to use The Pokemon Company’s intellectual property
I know, but I have to dream they’ll pull it out of the tailspin. It’s clear Niantic is ran by crypto frat boys with zero business experience, so they’d just wait for the game to burn out before they fix anything.
blazeraWell Im not buying any pokemon games until they take more than a year to develop, sounds like Im not gonna be buying any new ones anytime soon if keeping the short development times is where they're starting from for their development strategy.
Legends Arceus shows they can release a quality product, they just choose not to.
all-knight-partyEven legends Arceus could've used more time in the oven, even though it got a lot of things right.
The biggest thing Arceus needed was voice acting. It is ridiculous that the biggest franchise in the world doesn’t have voice acting in a game that has such animated discussions.
kodokuimo that’s far for the game’s biggest fault. it’s an eyesore, the plot wasn’t that good, and while they nailed a lot of things regarding gameplay, other things felt undercooked.
and frankly, there’s a bunch of big franchises (mario and zelda come to mind) where voice acting, while present, is nearly non-existant, so i never got the complaints about the lack of voice acting in pokemon.
Venia SilenteGonna heavily disagree there. Some franchises feel really ruined by their attempt to remove the player-videogame interface barrier. MonHun with its grunts for language back in 4th gen felt great and was even fun (reminded me of The Sims in a way) but when they added voice acting, the result honestly was a lot of cringe partly because of trying to also push face expressions into it (The Handler) or just because of adding corny, stupid attempts at voice acting (like most in-hunt shouts in Rise).
Honestly, adding voice acting for Pokémon feels even dangerous: most dialogue in the Pokémon games is already heavily corny, useless or flat-out redundant, but you’d also have to add Pokémon sounds and cries that somehow feel like they “match” as in coming from the same “universe” and have some variation across individual specimens. Because “klefki.midi” just doesn’t cut it anylonger.
Most of Nintendo’s high-end franchises have been able to “evolve” except for Pokemon. Even the proven -to-always-work ones have taken great steps forward. For a franchise based on an RPG that honestly has plenty to pull from it’s resistant to make itself better. The progression of a pokemon game becomes to expected and bland and to some extent it stops making sense in its own world. People have been making suggestions for years now and it’s pathetic they refuse to listen to it’s base. Scarlett and Violet should have been it’s death but people still bought into it so again, it works for sales so why would they need to add in extra resources? Once I picked up on the gimmicks (z-power and gigantamax) I knew it was getting ridiculous. The game just straight up relies on predictable concepts of grinding and higher levels encounters through progression yet it tries to pass itself off as openworld and non linear when you have orher games who clearly do it better. If a pokemon game held it’s same concepts and was called somethings else like Master Catcher or Battle Critters it wouldn’t even be considered as “great” as it is. You can’t say the same for the other franchises.
It's why all the side games made by other groups are often so much better than the mainline games, despite having a far smaller budget to work with. Because they actually try to do new and innovating things with the franchise.
Yeah. Mystery Dungeon and snap have been great spinoffs. I really hope PMD gets a new game. It’s been a while.
God mega evolutions we’re such a great addition in X/Y. Z moves were lame and I haven’t played a new Pokemon game since alpha Sapphire. Like yeah it’s Pokemon but it just feels like a product at this point. I know the point is to make money but maybe they should take a break. Pokemon games almost died in black and white because they haven’t changed.
You’re right that mega evolutions were great in that it gave certain Pokemon a second chance to be useful however even that took a wrong turn when they mainly focused all mega evolutions to to all the popular Pokemon who were already great to begin with. On top of that, it did continue forward which I feel would have been another opportunity to give those not-so-great pokemon that chance.
In a vacuum Megas were fun, but I think they were a net negative to the games as a whole.
In the single-player game, it’s basically an instant-win button. I don’t think pokemon needs to be difficult- I find most rom hacks and nuzlocke runs tedious and annoying. But having one button that just wins felt bad. The whole concept of temporary transformation felt like something that didn’t belong in pokemon, probably because its absence was something that separated Pokemon from competitors like Digimon and Yu-Gi-Oh.
Before Megas, new mechanics were usually things that made sense. Things that fit neatly into the world, may have been in the anime early, and were pretty logical conclusions that were only not in earlier games due to technical limitations. Splitting Special into SpAtk and SpDef, splitting moves within types by Phys/Spec, adding Steel type, Held Items, abilities, double and triple battles, breeding. To me, Megas felt drastically different, as do Z moves, Dynamaxing, and Terastillizing.
I would argue Pokemon has “evolved” too much, to the point where the game is bloated with way too many mechanics and is trying to be too many things.
You mentioned Z-mkves and Gigantamax. I would add in Mega Evolution, the Fairy type, Dynamax, Raid Battles, open areas. There’s a ridiculous amount of unique and dumb evolutions. There’s about 3x as many items as there should be. They keep on writing epic “kid saves the world” stories instead of “kid pushes back against the inconveniences imposed by small-time criminal” stories.
A lot of Nintendo’s franchises have had BOTH transformative new games AND new games in the older styles. Mario has consistently had both 3D and 2D releases, on top of all of the sports games and other spin-offs. Metroid had the Prime series and then Dread. Donkey Kong had 64 and then went back to 2D. Zelda has had 3D games for sure, but they have also had 2D games like Link’s Awakening on the Switch and previous handheld games.
I think GameFreak needs to grow and split into 2 teams: one to focus on 3D open-world Pokemon (like the Legends series) and one to focus on more traditional, 2.5D. Each team could take 2 years/game and they alternate releases. The 2D studio could add in re-makes as well: I am hopeful we get a Gen 5 re-make soon, but we are also getting to the point whete slme of the first re-makes are starting to need re-makes, like FRLG and HGSS.
Ah yes
Let’s dedicate a full team to Kanto remakes.
yeah i have enjoyed the new games but none of them have really been able to capture the magic of the old ones. dexit also didnt help.
somehow collecting all the pokemon felt more fun in the old games? i mean it was always a chore to do, but i remember being much more excited finding a rare pokemon in the older games than the new ones haha
jackpotpixelmon!!!
I’m hoping for the minetest version of that, it’d be impressive.
could pokemon take down a foss project?
Under capitalism, a petty company with money can do anything.
On the question of “should it be able”? No. Even if reusing the “”“assets”“” such as the graphics of the mons, they are postprocessed and converted for usage in a project like pixelmon to adjust for the visual style (“cubemon” style), which any pregraduate lawyer can identify as a Transformative Work.
zifnab25 [he/him, any]A game that has barely changed in over 30 years, except to expand the color palette occasionally? What can they possibly be quality controlling? Its not even like you have to spell check stuff when half your proper nouns are gobbley-removed.
I guess it would have been nice if PokemonGO had released in anything resembling a playable state. But people still threw endless amounts of cash at it. So how important can quality control even be?
Words are cheap.
I’ll believe it when I see it. The last time I personally believe they last put any effort into their games was X/Y. And only because they went from pixel to polys.
The story has been crap for a while. Even gen 1 has a more compelling story. The bad guys have been laughably stupid, and your rival… Your rival is an overly clingy person who desperately wants to be your best friend. The mechanics haven’t budged in forever. So much so a goldfish can accidentally win. Every game is more about that games mechanic then building the franchise or gameplay. And a gimmicks are half baked, propped up just to sell but never follow through on. How many pokémon actually got mega evolutions? Or Z-moves, or Dynamaxing and Gigantamaxing. I mean, I quit shield like maybe a few weeks after it came out and I have most of them because… It was just a temporary gimmick to slap on the box to try to sell it.
But beyond just a bare bones mechanics that is the game…
Scarlett and violet run terribly. And I know a lot of people kept trying to blame the switch hardware because god forbid you blame pokémon. But it’s not like it was just Scarlet and violet, sword and shield also ran pretty terribly not as bad but still bad. And they look like upscaled PS1 games. Mainstream pokémon games are just an example of putting in minimum effort while riding nostalgia and cartoon tie-in.
I hope when the next game gets announced, no one pre-orders. I know that won’t happen because people are afraid that somehow they’re going to run out of digital copies… But I can dream. I hope everyone waits until reviews come out. Because I want to remind you Nintendo doesn’t do returns.
NeatoAnd I know a lot of people kept trying to blame the switch hardware
And then TotK comes out and blows that excuse back to Kanto. Pokemon Company just doesn't care to try.
VCTRNI was about to point that out! I’ve yet to finish TotK but everytime I play it, I still get amazed at what they achieved. Yeah, there are some compromises, but that shit runs like butter.
Actual Nintendo is the best at bringing the most out of their hardware. I’m surprised Nintendo hasn’t stepped in quality wise but Pokemon is the money maker.
Honestly, I’d say Monolith Soft is the best, IMO. They brought us Xenoblade and they also worked on TotK, they actually do support development for a lot of the big titles for Nintendo.
Nintendo did actually issue an apology in their patch notes a while ago (version 1.1.0): https://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/60277/~/how-to-update-pok%C3%A9mon-scarlet-and-pok%C3%A9mon-violet
I would imagine they're stepping in for whatever the next project might be, but that's just me being hopeful haha
Thank you for putting my feelings to words. I haven’t even actually played a Pokémon game for more than 5 minutes since sun and moon as they were just so boring, the tutorials were so long, and the z move mechanic basically didn’t impact the game at all as the game isn’t ever hard enough where you have to use a Z move.
I still play the older games but it’s because I find the experience more balanced and enjoyable.
I skipped sword and shield. Pokemon scarlet and violet ran terribly. Yet even though I went into it expecting to have a bad time, I still enjoyed the gameplay loop?
I’m extremely conflicted because I know that if it wasn’t for it being pokemon I would have likely dropped S&V like a hot potato. And with the lie about reduced pokemon in each game due to having to recreate the models from scratch (and then people finding out Sw&Sh models were just 3ds models) it just rubbed me the wrong way.
All in all I can’t help but think of what the games could be if they took the time to do it right.
People blaming the switch are insane.
This is the same console that has Xenoblade 3. There’s absolutely no comparison.
people blaming the Switch
when the S&V devs decided that for some reason the game has to render a skybox for outer space that’s ~1400 times the size of the world-skybox that you already use for sky daylight and it’s already ~80 times too large for that
Come on!
kratoz29Huh, you really make it discouraging to keep on the series for me, I’m currently playing them in cannon order and I’m playing Omega Ruby (I’m gonna skip 4th gen because I have already played it).
For sure, you’ll be set to black and white 2. But to me there really is an inverse correlation between how popular the game’s got and the quality of the game itself. I will say if you somehow can fit pokémon Arceus into your gameplay if you haven’t already you should. I know it’s not mainline but it was a lot of fun.
They should just have a series that goes out regularly for casual fans and some spin-off for their older audience. Like Pokémon generation me red.
They could buff the difficulty and make the game more complex. They could even have more mature themes(not adult) just like personal growth and the pain of loss kinda stuff.
Palworld is set to officially release at the start of next year. It’s clearly very Pokémon inspired, but looks much more impressive than any existing Pokémon game. I wonder if Palworld will help shake the Pokémon Company into upping their game.
StraferFor most people the Pokémon IP is a much bigger draw than a potentially better game though. Game Freak are in a position where due to the Pokémon IP they can release a game riddled with issues and still sell well.
For me it's the integration between games through Pokémon Home and the way everything just opens up after the story ends.
I know the latter is in quite a lot of other monster catching games, but you can only really find the former in Pokémon.
I haven’t checked in on it for a long time but I remember kindred fates also looking promising.
Steam link for those interested: store.steampowered.com/app/…/Kindred_Fates/
Normally I give a side eye to any game that looks like they specifically hired a lawyer to make sure their bootleg is legal, but the legit franchise is practically bootleg at this point so if this can out-Pokemon Nintendo then I’m all for it.
creatures with machineguns
If I wanted that I’d just play Digimon. Not that the idea is bad, it just… feels to me more like an attempt at a replacement for Digimon than for Pokémon. Equipping everyone with machineguns and joining in into the slaughter feels like it absurdily misses the point of Pokémon for me.
(That said, I’m not con adapting some of the Palcreatures minus machineguns as fakémon if I find out I do like them)
Kindred Fates looks more interesting.
There’s also Coromon, which even has a similar style.
Steam link for those interested: store.steampowered.com/app/1218210/Coromon/
What happened to temtem? I thought that game would shake the pokemon company?
No game is ever going to replace Pokemon because you can see how many people complain about the state of the games, but they are still there consuming the franchise, so even when in their opinions the games are horrible, they are still there sucking the companys dick off. Pokemon has too many loyal fans.
I think people criticized Temtem for being too microtransaction heavy.
Steam link for those interested: store.steampowered.com/app/745920/Temtem/
Starlet [she/her, it/its]with regular releases
I guess having fewer releases isn’t an option
BabaIsPissed [he/him]maybe it is?
One would think the rational response from a development perspective is to make fewer releases but just as regular (ie.: change the release freq from “one per year” to “one per three years”).
They should have taken the Assassin’s Creed path.
they lied on multiple occasions, so why even believes literally anything that comes out of their rotten mouths
I feel it in my gut that some day Pokemon is going to have his “BotW”-like game that will make it revolutionary and relevant again, but until then we’re gonna get a lot of stinkers.
JackbyDevAnd you’ll have a certain group of diehard fans who believe it “isn’t a real pokémon game” because of the changes lol.
Pokemon never catered to the die hards.
The money they make is always from new fans. Which is why they went that path for multiple generations. I think this latest release caused a dip in profits, so only now are they like… “Let’s give them a bone.”