aquietjuneAug 9, 2023

Some thoughts I’m having (again) about stories:

I’m not interested in finding out about the twist before it happens.

Unless the author asks me to solve the mystery, or to question everything that is said, openly or though subtext (eg Umineko), I want to be surprised by the developments of the story; I want the whole setup payoff affair and the narrative devices to work as intended; I want to experience fiction at its fullest, trusting the author has my best interests at heart.

I think it’s an act of generosity that is needed given that stories structures and dynamics are in the end limited.

#stories #reading #writing

aquietjuneAug 9, 2023
Show threadNikelui

@aquietjune I'll take the opportunity to link one of my favorite articles about Lambdadelta and Bernkastel and their different approach to reading, since it seems relevant

https://thedicequeen.wordpress.com/?s=Lambdadelta+

Warning: it contains a lot of spoilers for Umineko up to chapter 8.

Search Results for “Lambdadelta ” – Dice Queen

RPGs and Other Things

Dice Queen
Aug 9, 2023 at 1:40pmWeb
Show threadaquietjuneAug 9, 2023

@nikelui exceptionally on point! It explains why I use Lambdadelta as my avatar 90% of the times lol.

But jokes aside, I think the concepts are close but not perfectly coinciding, or rather, they’re somewhat orthogonal — I think there are mindless consumers on both sides of my “being a generous reader” debate: those who consume anything no matter what, and those who are ready to question the storytelling and point out mistakes.
On the other hand, rather than passive and active, I would also use the terms explorative vs path-driven readers (the path may be the plot, the mystery or other things)

Show threadaquietjuneAug 9, 2023

@nikelui explorative vs path-driven as described here: “Lambda is entranced by the question, the possibilities, the what ifs, the interesting. But Bern just wants the answer: the solution. She wants to get through it one and done.”

And I think that a lot of our choices in entertainment derive from this — narratives where you can easily get lost in vs more straightforward narratives.

I’ve been both kinds of reader (it heavily depends on the mood), and what I found is that both are valid as long as the approach is right for the story at hand. Bad things happen otherwise.

What do you think?

Show threadNikeluiAug 9, 2023
@aquietjune for me it also depends heavily on the mood. I might start making theories and give myself a pat on the back if everything falls into place the way I have imagined, or I can't be bothered to cross-examine the alibi of 10 suspects on a timeline and just read straight to the end. I'll say that after Umineko (and reading that article) I'm tending more often on the active approach.
But yes, in the end there is no correct way to read. The important thing is to enjoy the story, and you need trust between the author and the reader (this is why things such as the rules of the mystery genre were born).
Show threadaquietjuneAug 10, 2023
@nikelui what is most important to me (and the reason for posting the thread) is to allow a conversation with the author: engage in what they say, come up with questions of your own, and be critical of it, but try not to reduce the work of an author to *just* the plot.
Because outside of very specific genres, the plot may not the point. And listening to readers saying that a story is worthless because “I could spot the culprit from miles away,” because they’re so well-read and blasé about fiction, is like watching Erika “revealing” Maria’s teacup magic as a trick.
Instead, let the authors do their magic ✨
Show threadNikeluiAug 10, 2023
@aquietjune absolutely  . I'd rather have something that is predictable from the very first chapter and beautifully executed, than having the author be antagonistic and pull something out of their magic hat, for the sake of being unpredictable. Otherwise it's just Erika and Battler's duel. It might be fun as a game, but I'm not going to be invested in a mystery where the locked room has no roof or a 2 meters long chain.