When future #historians look back at the period 2010-2024, how will they balance in their analysis the following factors, when analysing the policies & actions of the successive #Tory administrations of this period?
a. incompetence
b. ignorance (stupidity)
c. corruption
d. strategy (to include enrichment of particular groups)
c. & d. many well be linked but one can also see political scenarios where d. is the result of ideology not corruption.
(This work has, of course, already started!)
@ChrisMayLA6
I would say the intertwined c & d will be the vast majority of issue.
I would replace b with "misinformed". Tories seem to have a remarkably sheltered and misinformed view of the world and its drivers (because of c & d). Centrists and compromisers have been driven from the party, so we are left with people who do not use facts and are driven by ideology.
I give incompetence a mere 1%. The incompetent are there by strategy. Tories are very competent in what they want.
'Tories are very competent in what they want'! - very well put!
I guess the only issue I would have with 'misinformed' is it hints at a good faith attempt to understand the world which has miss-fired.... but I'm not convinced about the good faith element (at least in characterising b.)... but I do see your point... perhaps b.1 & b.2... (sorry this is starting to sound like feedback on a/your dissertation proposal, apologies)
@ChrisMayLA6
I appreciate the feedback
I struggled finding the right word, but settled on "misinformed". I certainly agree that no good faith has been earned. Perhaps " willfully misinformed" is better. I'm also open to any alternative terms.
But my point remains. Tories are not motivated by stupidity/ignorance or incompetence. Rather by a distinct world view of corporatism, "natural order" and pursuit of power/money. IMHO.
@TCatInReality @ChrisMayLA6 I like "wilfully misinformed"; nice phrase, and thought provoking.
I have felt myself for a while that the incompetence on daily display is a symptom of a deeper cause. I originally saw the deeper cause as an individual phenomenon, but now I'm beginning to wonder if it's more class based. IMO the defining feature of govt since Johnson is that they don't care. About anything. Competence takes time and effort, and they don't care enough to do that. 1/2
@TCatInReality @ChrisMayLA6 2/2 I am now wondering if that is the outcome of a trajectory that might be evident in British politics since the days of Thatcher - a gradual detachment of the right wing elite from the rest of us. They have gradually got used to the fact that they can do anything and get away with it. And they do.
It's ironic that it has been largely brought about by the effort to get the UK out of the EU, which its proponents had to care about a great deal in the beginning.
@robparsons @ChrisMayLA6
I have been down a similar path. My conclusions:
1) Tories (esp top leaders) believe in a "natural order", that entitles them to lead and to profit. Suffering and side effects are for other, lesser beings.
2) Tory leadership and aspirants care *deeply* about that order - mostly prestige, power and money. Never forget, Mr Johnson's energy spent on gold wallpaper.
1/2
3) It's not exactly "class", although it is that. Those who can help their mates will always get a piece of the pie. That creates a window for aspirants to get ahead
4) This didn't start with Thatcher. Certainly Brexit, party purges and the rise of misinformation have all accelerated the trend.
5) It's not just the UK. It's a worldwide trend and it's evolution is incompatible with democracy. An informed and active populace is the only solution.
#GeneralEelctionNow
@robparsons @ChrisMayLA6
I fully agree, except about it being more pronounced in the UK.
The right has been rising around the world for a decade, largely on the back of disinformation. Brexit and the 2016 election of Trump definitely played critical roles in validating the approach. Both created massive cultural divisions from formerly minor issues and were used to seize power and wealth. Of course, it accelerated.
@robparsons @ChrisMayLA6
I agree with your overall premise.
I just think it's a broad trend - and trying to rank the severity is not very helpful.
But I'd be happy to hear your further thoughts on the UK
@TCatInReality @ChrisMayLA6
I was leaning towards "deluded" but that, too, suggests a lack of agency. Perhaps "wilfully ignorant" best describes the "don't know and don't care" attitude of the Tories to the impacts of their activities.
I think there's a rich seam to be mined concerning the wisdom of having a generation of policy makers who have always been sheltered from the consequences of their actions and so do not feel the need to connect cause and effect.
@Stevenheywood @ChrisMayLA6
Nearly the entirety of British history is sheltered, disconnected leaders. But somehow, their fear of the mob has led to greater/longer democracy (within a monarchy) than just about anywhere.
We must remember that.
@Stevenheywood @ChrisMayLA6
It is gruesome to see the poor blamed and demonised. But it's no surprise - and also why the trend is an existential threat to democracy.
But if you believe in "superiors", then the "inferiors" must be shown their place.
@jspk @ChrisMayLA6
True.
But my point is that incompetence is introduced deliberately to slow/stop a bureaucratic process.
If it's something Tories want (Eg PPE for their mates), they can't streamline the process fast enough.
@ChrisMayLA6
Apologies for the tangent.
But IMO the underpinning ethos of the Tory Party is that it is the natural party of government.
Everything else flows from that.
- Corruption, well, not ideal but acceptable if it's not too blatant.
- Incompetence, well not really, can't be, he's One Of Us, a natural ruler.
- Ignorance? don't be silly, it's obvious we know best.
- Strategy towards particular groups: Maybe. Groups must accept Tories' divine right.
@ChrisMayLA6
I would also add:
"Since we are the natural party of government, anyone who opposes us _must be an enemy_."
That explains a lot.
@ChrisMayLA6
This also illuminates the British consitution.
It relies on "good chaps", which is why they have never seen a reason to write it down; personal honour was an absolute and cads like Joseph Chamberlain were an outlier, useful but fundamentally not One Of Us.
(Obviously this is a moveable feast and often honoured more in the breach.)
@SoftwareTheron @ChrisMayLA6
100% 👍
Tories believe in a natural order - not just to rule but to profit.
Everything and everyone is there for them to use for personal gain. It's a mockery to call them "conservative" when they only conserve their power and exploit the rest.
broken link?
no, works now.... got a feeling I read that when it was first posted... certainly makes a lot of sense
Martin Dean #FBPE
Emeritus Prof Christopher May
Phil Thane ✅
TC Won't Give In To Lies
rob
Steven Heywood
Michael Robinson
Jan Spakula
Dan
Martin Otto
MarkNW