anon maskodon
leifSo the billionaires’ families are gonna get billed for all of this like the time my family got billed for my ambulance ride, right? Right?
Cats Who Draw 
@studiofox that would be lovely!!
Willow (she/her)@studiofox THIS is what I wanna know. People get billed for S&R on the mountains here ALL the time. Absolutely should apply to these people.
Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE@MsHearthWitch @studiofox You gotta know the difference between the wave you give to the chopper to say "help" and the wave you give to the chopper to say "piss off".
Colorblind Cowboy@MsHearthWitch @studiofox It should definitely be billed to the company that sent the thing. You should have insurance for this.
@colorblindcowboy @studiofox For sure. Tax payers should not be footing the bill for billionaire's mistakes.
Gods know we're footing the bill for their rest of their shit.
Gods know we're footing the bill for their rest of their shit.
@colorblindcowboy @MsHearthWitch I was reading insurance speculation and the idea that the sub wasn’t certified in any way made people think insurers wouldn’t touch it. So I’m wondering how they would do liability and insurance at all.
Neil@colorblindcowboy @MsHearthWitch @studiofox they better hurry because that company is going to get sued into oblivion
okanogen VerminEnemyFromWithin@MsHearthWitch US Coast Guard is not allowed to charge for rescues by statute. They can fine and recover costs for environmental damage. Some states charge for rescues, some don't. The US Park Service charges between $1000-1600/hr if a helicopter is needed but nothing otherwise....
@Okanogen Yeah except a lot more than just the US Coast Guard were involved.
I'm not American, but my country has spent money looking for those idiots.
I'm not American, but my country has spent money looking for those idiots.
@MsHearthWitch
Can't speak for other countries.
Can't speak for other countries.
phi1997@MsHearthWitch
What happens if you refuse to pay? They probably just sue you, but can you imagine them dropping you back off where they found you?
@studiofox
What happens if you refuse to pay? They probably just sue you, but can you imagine them dropping you back off where they found you?
@studiofox
@phi1997 @MsHearthWitch you get hit with the bill afterwards and then comes the debt collectors and such.
:animated_verified:防空識別區ᴏᴜᴛᴇʀɴᴀᴛɪᴏɴᴀʟ:adm1::adm2:@studiofox Hahaha, good one!
DadsForSensibleCurfews
Aviva Gary@studiofox If only 🤑
ScottinSoCal 🇺🇦 🕊 🏳🌈As with most everything else, taxpayers will be covering the costs of the oligarch's mistakes.
Bonnie Schwertner@studiofox It’s only fair.
Orc@studiofox I hope not. Billing for emergency transport and rescue is an abomination before G-d.
Locksmith@studiofox
"Oh my god! Both of your legs are broken! Let me call an ambulance!"
"NO!!! DO NOT CALL AN AMBULANCE! It's going to bankrupt the hell out of me!"
This is not even a joke.
@locksmithprime truth. I’ve known a lot of people in situations like that - me included
Hill@studiofox it doesnt matter even if they do theyre so loaded it wont be an issue
Justin@studiofox If only this were the case. This is all sorts of messed up.
Hawaii Kai Auntie@studiofox Nope. But if it makes you feel any better, the irony of going down while viewing the Titanic should tickle you.
@studiofox
No. The US Coast Guard doesn't bill for rescues of anyone. Not kayakers in remote rapids, not commercial fishing boats in the Bering Sea, and not here. However they don't do recovery operations. That will be private companies and the company and families will pay. I know eating the rich is fun, but this is a bit ghoulish. They're dead.
No. The US Coast Guard doesn't bill for rescues of anyone. Not kayakers in remote rapids, not commercial fishing boats in the Bering Sea, and not here. However they don't do recovery operations. That will be private companies and the company and families will pay. I know eating the rich is fun, but this is a bit ghoulish. They're dead.
@Okanogen
eating the rich isn't fun--it's necessary.
as i've said elsewhere, rescue and aide should be a service for everyone on land or sea. the fact that countries can agree to this for international waters but not on their own land is ludicrous and the truly ghoulish thing.
if I had to choose an end - paying 250K to die instantly in a sub and then get heralded around the world as an explorer and genius and all around great chap would definitely outweigh dying slowly from a treatable disease that I can't afford meds for and then get constantly told that it's my fault for not bootstrapping my way up. That's fucking ghoulish.
as for ghoulish:
ghoulish is what happens to the poor who can't get food and are told it's their fault.
or the sick who can't afford treatment and are told it's their fault.
or any of the countless people who aren't blessed to be "normal" in this world and then discriminated against, hurt, killed, looked down on, etc.
ghoulish isn't critiquing 5 people that died in a trash can of hubris. nor is it about critiquing the world's response to them.
the fact that i'm supposed to hold my hat and wipe my eyes for these people without critiquing their fucking actions and their relationship with the broader world is ridiculous.
Pamela Ehn@Okanogen @studiofox there’s nothing to recover. A catastrophic implosion leaves barely anything. They’ve all been blown to smithereens.
@cadenza
Human remains, no, but pieces of the vessel yes.
Human remains, no, but pieces of the vessel yes.
Log 🪵@cadenza @Okanogen @studiofox Explosions leave smithereens. Implosions leave smasheroons. They are very different at a microcrystallography level.
ToweroftheArchmage Antifascist@Okanogen @studiofox
Yup, they're dead. And aside from that poor 19 year old, fuck them. Especially fuck that kid's dad.
Yup, they're dead. And aside from that poor 19 year old, fuck them. Especially fuck that kid's dad.
João Tiago Rebelo@studiofox not on the seas. If they did that to these billionaires' families they'd do it to poor people too. International Laws of the Sea have provisions to force S&R irrespective of income, religion, creed, etc., for free, for all souls in dire need.
@jt_rebelo and that’s great! But that’s also my point. Helping people everywhere should be a free service for everyone. Just because billions of people are landlocked doesn’t mean they should suffer more.
@studiofox I agree, but people think the other way (let them pay like it happens on land). Around here (south-western Europe) S&R on land is also free (and public). Battle with all your democratic means to impose it where you are: organize, teach/inform and vote.
Philip Wilson@jt_rebelo @studiofox
International Laws of the Sea don't seem to apply in the Mediterranean when there are refugees involved.
Go figure.
International Laws of the Sea don't seem to apply in the Mediterranean when there are refugees involved.
Go figure.
@PhilipVWilson they do and are being applied. Apart from several NGOs doing it (some getting criminal charges for it...), there are many navy and police vessels there, even from countries that don't have anything to do with the Mediterranean coasts. There are pushbacks and refusals to help, but those are against the Laws of the Seas as much as not searching for the rich people in the sub. The dissonance is that rich people don't get pushbacks nor refusals, in that I agree.
@studiofox
@studiofox
🦋 Mel 
daryl 
🤡@studiofox actually I think the company should get the bill. Oh and sorry bout your uncle.
Reina 
@studiofox Did I miss smth?
@reina they found the wreckage of the sub with the billionaires on it. They figured it imploded on Sunday (navy picked up the sound) but the coast guard and everyone still did the whole search and rescue thing that costs a bajillion dollars that will just get written off but I was commenting on the fact that in America we have to pay for our own ambulance ride and many people choose not to and end up worse or dead because of it.
@reina and what I’d like is for all aid to be free for everyone
Julie WebgirlI'm ok with the fact that won't happen. What I really want is for the company to get FINED so much they implode like their sub. They're in Everett, WA.
Washington's L&I have been calling companies out for fraud and misusing COVID help monies. Washington's AG has sued Amazon, Comcast & handfuls of cellular companies multiple times. This gives me hope.
@juliewebgirl I hope as well
PB Livin'@juliewebgirl @studiofox I hope the driver's family can sue if it's considered a workplace accident
Idk the situation, but if he was working as an employee or contractor I'd think that's different than being a customer
But heck, the passengers' families might even be able to sue if the vehicle's safety risks weren't fully accurately disclosed or it was known to not have passed appropriate safety tests (IANAL, just my layman assumptions)
Good point about workplace accident. From what I understand the passengers signed injury/death waivers stating the craft was experimental. Not so sure though since safety tests were purposely not done. I have mixed feelings about the CEO. He should be alive to answer for his actions but then again... poetic justice and all that.
@juliewebgirl @studiofox my thoughts exactly
Now I heard the CEO always did the driving? LOL If that's true his family should get nothing.
@juliewebgirl @wh0sthatd0g this all came down to fighting over the controller doesn’t it?
@juliewebgirl @studiofox Negligent damage to a world cultural site and burial ground: $10M fine.
Getting roasted by James Cameron on ABC News for being as reckless as the Titanic captain: bankruptcy.
t o d d w a r n e r@studiofox It should be noted that if the Coast Guard rescues you at sea because you did something unwise, you don't get billed, generally.
xanatax 🐰@studiofox … right? I’m thinking this over … but shouldn’t we, basically just liquidate OceanGate to repay Search & Rescue? 😘 also, we should spend a few $$ on the Coast Guard to upgrade for submarine rescues. 🤷♀️
This rescue effort was Great, but not well prepared, in advance. Should be Coast Guard units ready to do this … like, in all territorial waters, 24/7? especially, as we start running more, and more civilian submarines?
@xanatax the more that comes out now the more ludicrous this is. The navy reported the implosion sound to the coast guard on Sunday so that had a very good idea that the sun was smushed. However, for *reasons* they deployed all the things plus called in private crews. Meanwhile, the coast guard is releasing cryptic ass statements like “until the time is up we have act like this is a search and rescue”.
Ugh.
Like, yeah, I’m down with having a bunch of subs ready to go off and explore and save people and things but man. Transparency.
@studiofox … wow, yeah, and also … I can imagine being like, Navy Crew, getting these orders, and reading between the lines … basically this is a huge impromptu drill. we’ll play, “let’s pretend.” — and part of it is, “people are watching, we’ll look like huge jerks if we don’t.” — their loved ones were given false hope, but didn’t feel let down. rescue/recovery will do that … we don’t KNOW, so, regardless, until we can PROVE it, try to rescue! a Rescue culture thing. 👍
@studiofox … Ambulance Paramedics will do this sometimes, if they can, btw. 🤫 Traffic Fatality, but family are watching … they’ll maybe do CPR until they get the body in the Ambulance, and get on the road … family sees the busy effort and isn’t as traumatized. make a Doctor at the Hospital declare the patient “Dead on Arrival” to the ER, rather than just leave a body on the road, in front of their fam. 🤷♀️
@studiofox … follow-up, just b/c I said liquidate OceanGate. 🤣 Can I buy all their old subs tho? These things *ARE* “safe-enough,” as long as they never go deeper than people can just SCUBA away from. The tech seems really, quite good, down to 100m, and not-too-bad down to 250m.
4km was waaayyy to arrogant, without lots of lab testing. … but this DIY janky tech, basically fine at SCUBA depth! (a) actually, for real, it’s okay at 100m. (b) at least the exit strategy is obvious!
@studiofox … I can imagine these things being “safe-enough,” anywhere the actual sea-floor, or lake-bed is <125m. So, even if it sank to the bottom, won’t be much risk. Also, that shallow, we can just keep it attached to the support ship. 🤣🤷♀️ We can “hard-wire” things at that range. … including a crane to pull it up, if needed.
Waaaayyy, too greedy, … diving deeper than SCUBA can rescue. but interesting to learn this cheaper tech kinda works, when shallow-only mode!
@xanatax the fact that it made the trip several times over the past few years is what amazes me.