Why were early humans so fit if their diet pretty much only consisted of meat?

https://lemmy.world/post/210448

Why were early humans so fit if their diet pretty much only consisted of meat? - Lemmy.world

I’m talking about before we figured out we could grow vegetables and fruits. Early humans are often shown as being fit and in shape, yet our diet pretty much only consisted of meat. We were hunters. So why the hell were they so fit? I thought a healthy diet mattered more than just being active constantly?

This is my non-expert answer, but iirc, if the animals you're eating are eating a well balanced diet, you can actually be mostly carnivorous. If anybody who actually know what they're talking about knows that I'm wrong, feel free to call me out,

Why would early humans have a mostly meat diet? There's plenty of foragable herbs, vegetables, and fruits to eat. Go to anywhere near the equator. Bananas grow on the trees.

We also have archeological evidence that producing beer happened before agriculture. So us humans were clearly pretty experimental with food.

Ancient humans probably ate a great diversity of plant life than we did!

The fruits and vegetables that we know today are nothing like those from 10k years ago. Bananas of today didn't exist even a few 100 years ago.
Yes but there were and still are wild, edible fruit and vegetables. Humans were hunter gatherers. We have always eaten whatever we could get a hold of. We're omnivores for a reason.
Yes but they were not what we have today. Lower sugar content. More hardy. Tougher skins. Less yield.
The claim that was being refuted was that humans ate a diet that "pretty much only consisted of meat". That is not the case despite the fact that our crops today are bred to be larger and more calorie dense. Humans did eat vegetable and fruit alongside meat in our ancient past.
I was not stating that they only ate meat just that the meat they ate was far more lean than the industrially farmed meat we have.
The wild ancestors of our modern food did exist. And there's a reason we have highly advanced cultivars of those foods, it's because people were eating them before they were cultivated. Once agriculture started, people took the foods they regularly foraged and started to grow them. Then they would replant the ones they liked and toss/eat the seeds of the ones they didn't. Do that a few thousand years and you've got highly edible and great tasting produce, but it all started with people trying to grow what they already ate.
Yes but they were not what we have today. Lower sugar content. More hardy. Tougher skins. Less yield.

Bananas grow on the trees.

Bananas grow on a herbaceous flowering plant.

Keep in mind that there is no such thing as a tree. They are tall and sturdy and woody and have a bunch of leaves on top, it is not unreasonable to call a banana plant a tree. Hell, the Wikipedia page for "Tree" goes back and forth on broader and narrower definitions and whether bananas and bamboo and so on count within them.

There’s no such thing as a tree (phylogenetically)

Dendronization – Evolving into a tree-like morphology. (In the style of “carcinization”.) From ‘dendro’, the ancient Greek root for tree.

Eukaryote Writes Blog

Your source claims

Wood ... is also not a clear phyletic category.

However we all know wood is that which is scary.

There’s no such thing as a tree (phylogenetically)

Dendronization – Evolving into a tree-like morphology. (In the style of “carcinization”.) From ‘dendro’, the ancient Greek root for tree.

Eukaryote Writes Blog
what I get from this explanation is that trees are the crabs of the plant world

I mean, you gotta understand that we worked hard as fuck for our food. We ran that shit down for miles after miles and did lots of physical labor.

So, even if our diet was mostly meat, that didn't mean we were unhealthy or fat. You can eat straight meat and be fit. You need the protein in the first place.

Yup, that is my understanding. Constantly on the move, working hard, and eat lean meats since the animals were wild game not factory fattened.
Humanity's main method of hunting was basically just "follow prey at a steady pace and let it tire itself out before we do". So they pretty much did a hell of a lot of cardio.

Yup!

Cheetahs are the fastest land animal for top speed and almost all fours legged animal is de facto faster than us. But two things we can do best, being smart (noticing patterns, imagination and language) and walking, we do mind bogglingly better than our nearest competition.

Those two go together.

Opposable thumbs and the brain power to use hands evolved earlier in hominids. Our line of the ancestry kept getting smarter and smarter with brains that required more and more energy as our ancestors kept evolving. To feed their enormously powerful brain, the species needed to make the body as efficient as possible, which led to our feet changing to support bipedal locomotion, which enabled our long distance hiker superpower through more efficient energy usage compared to four legged walking, even though four can go much faster, and left our hands free to do whatever we want all the time. Our bodies lost almost all hair, and evolved to sweat excessively, which gave us the ability to keep cool while we literally walked large animals to death from hyperthermia, simply by walking after them until they dropped dead.

Humans can do that, but I would guess they more often tried trapping, fishing, and stealthy hunting? Running after an animal over long distances isn’t ideal. It’s a great way to get hurt, animals are very fast and you can lose the trail or they go where you can’t follow, and not to mention exhausting.
Humans are believed to have risen the food chain due to our ability to sweat and endurance chase our prey the way other predators couldn’t. This concept is known as “persistence hunting” and basically involved chasing our prey at a slow but consistent rate until they exhausted themselves and we could catch them
Yes for sure, I'm aware of our unique advantage to hunt that way, it is cool. I just think during human history and development, whenever possible, hunters also employed their ingenuity to hunt smarter. Even animals try to reduce their risks of injury and avoid burning calories. They'll stop a pursuit if it seems too hard or risky.
Humans became the top predators due to “persistence hunting” which literally involved running slower than the prey but for longer distances until the prey was exhausted.
Also not an expert but we weren't just hunters, we were hunter gatherers. One group hunted animals while the other group would pick wild berries, fruit, wild vegetables or whatever other edible plants they could find. Not to mention what the other person said about animals with a balanced diet having much healthier meat than the factory farmed animals of today.
The diets of most hunter gatherer tribes today are only about 30% meat. It was probably the same back then.
Do you mean they mostly ate "animals"? ("meat" is a modern supermarket product). And by "fit" do you mean "not dead"? And exactly which "early humans" are you talking about? "Animals" consist of meat, organs stomach contents, brain matter, bones, skin etc. If they ate all of those parts then they would likely be balanced enough, and they all would have craved and eaten whatever veges they could forage too, particularly in tropical regions where fruit would be abundant.
They had a super high protein diet and were hunter gatherers constantly on the move, only the most physically dominant men survived, and the most physically dominant men found physically dominant woman to be attractive because to them what was hot was a woman they could kill a fucking deer with her bare hands. I’m guessing they really only ate a high fatty high-protein diet of meat, mixed with wild fruits and vegetables, and such, however, life expectancy was really low even though they were probably in pretty good shape. the reality is that back in those days people were a lot stronger and a lot taller because big strong men fucked big, strong woman and it wasn’t until people got more comfortable on farms that they decided to go for the cute girl with the fat ass and big titties, that was 5 foot four that’s creating shorter weaker men. I’ve read old Roman accounts of when they were facing off against Germanic and Viking like tribes, and they basically described it like our average man was about 5‘,7“ tall fighting a 6 foot, eight barbarian with a gigantic battle axe. This is the reason why the Romans deferred to very large, broad shields, and a stabbing sword so that way when they raised that battle axe real high they could take the initial hit with their shield, and then stab them in their gut
Bro's out here writing fan faction
Dude, I was at the top of my class in history, they gave me a choice between AP honors history, which was essentially mad, essays and homework or meso American history, which is basically make shit up about central America pretty Columbus based on the little bit of data that we have
What you need is a degree in anthropology (or similar) since you asserting expertise in history while creating a story about prehistory.
I'm not exactly sure on the fitness standards. If you look at indigenous African tribes that still hunt baboon in the night they don't look especially fit by today's standards, kinda like average people really, although I'm sure they're beasts on the endurance front and they can shoot a baboon off the tree in the darkness of night with a makeshift bow which is mad impressive.

fit? possibly - or not, art of fit healthy people sells better than art of average slovenly people. artists need to eat too.

fitness aside, our ancient hunter/gatherer ancestors didnt live very long - hunting/gathering for survival is not a task that engenders longevity, especially when you're tens of thousands of years away from discovering metal.

and then when we discovered farming/animal husbandry, we started having issues with diseases & plague. the average lifespan didnt noticeably increase, despite there being less active threats (baring war and famine, of course).

I'm out camping right now, and know of a dozen species of edible wild plant within 100 feet of me. I guarantee early humans knew of more edible plants than I do, and ate them regularly.
I mean meat is high on protein which is what you need to build muscle mass which is one of the requisites for being fit. Then running around all day chasing animals to eat them is gonna give you some really insane cardio, plus developed muscle from carrying around the prey and the hunting gear. So I have not idea what are you talking about, also pretty sure ancient humans already knew about edible plants and fungi.
Do we actually know that early humans were fit? A couple of big things to consider are that we mostly see depictions of early humans made by marketing teams trying to get people to go to their museum, or see their movie, or eat their new fad diet. That's not likely to be realistic. And that natural selection would have culled the weak, slow, and otherwise deficient. If we picked a sub-population of humanity right now that would be similar to the humans of the past that survived to 30, most of us would not be in that group. Furthermore, it is absolutely possible that all of the humans in a given region were malnourished because they didn't have access to a varied diet. They might likely die out and be later replaced by humans that had learned to grow crops, bring cattle, or otherwise provide for the deficiencies in diet that the surrounding area couldn't give them.
I fully support the notion of thicc cavepeoples.

I think it's important to realize that almost everyone is plenty healthy at 30 years old assuming they haven't grown enormously fat. Health decline is a more recent issue as people have lived long enough for organ failure/cancer to take over as the leading cause of death instead of malnourishment/injury.

A huge problem was teeth. Eating those old hard seeds and fruits plus grinding down greens wore away teeth. Once the teeth are gone, wild animals quickly suffer malnourishment and early humans would have had the same issue. Living to a ripe old age would require soft food, plentiful access to it, and not dying to infection. Only then would long term health be a real concern for our ancient ancestor.

The idea that plants are healthy is modern propaganda.

We have a gallbladder like other carnivores (and unlike any herbivore) and our cecum (appendix ) is vestigial, most people even have it removed. we can extract minimal nutritional value from plants because of this. Meat on the other hand is 100% bio available and is the reason we have large brains and small abdomens. we literally traded plants for brains.

Early humans where fit because the alternative was being eaten by a fucking wolf

That is not entirely true. The anthropological and archaeological evidence shows that humans have been omnivores since they first existed, the exceptions being cultures such as the Inuit that live in areas where plants are scarce, but even they eat some plants.

Note that it is true that once humans (really pre-humans) started eating more meat, they were able to extend their range as meat is a denser source of nutrients, but humans are still omnivores rather than obligate carnivores.

I guess Darwin's law, hominids were fit but what was their average life span? 25?
Firstly, after consuming meat, they were not sitting in an AC room glued to their smartphones or laptops. They had natural cardio. Second, animal meat that we consume today, those are bred by us specifically for meat production. It ain’t healthy.

You have a false premise. Early humans did not eat primarily meat. It was a well balanced diet of about 65% animal products and 35% plant based. Source

Also, there was less specialization of roles, so people simply did more physical labor than people today, who sit at a desk 8hrs a day.

The paradoxical nature of hunter-gatherer diets: meat-based, yet non-atherogenic - European Journal of Clinical Nutrition

Objective: Field studies of twentieth century hunter-gathers (HG) showed them to be generally free of the signs and symptoms of cardiovascular disease (CVD). Consequently, the characterization of HG diets may have important implications in designing therapeutic diets that reduce the risk for CVD in Westernized societies. Based upon limited ethnographic data (n=58 HG societies) and a single quantitative dietary study, it has been commonly inferred that gathered plant foods provided the dominant energy source in HG diets. Method and Results: In this review we have analyzed the 13 known quantitative dietary studies of HG and demonstrate that animal food actually provided the dominant (65%) energy source, while gathered plant foods comprised the remainder (35%). This data is consistent with a more recent, comprehensive review of the entire ethnographic data (n=229 HG societies) that showed the mean subsistence dependence upon gathered plant foods was 32%, whereas it was 68% for animal foods. Other evidence, including isotopic analyses of Paleolithic hominid collagen tissue, reductions in hominid gut size, low activity levels of certain enzymes, and optimal foraging data all point toward a long history of meat-based diets in our species. Because increasing meat consumption in Western diets is frequently associated with increased risk for CVD mortality, it is seemingly paradoxical that HG societies, who consume the majority of their energy from animal food, have been shown to be relatively free of the signs and symptoms of CVD. Conclusion: The high reliance upon animal-based foods would not have necessarily elicited unfavorable blood lipid profiles because of the hypolipidemic effects of high dietary protein (19–35% energy) and the relatively low level of dietary carbohydrate (22–40% energy). Although fat intake (28–58% energy) would have been similar to or higher than that found in Western diets, it is likely that important qualitative differences in fat intake, including relatively high levels of MUFA and PUFA and a lower ω-6/ω-3 fatty acid ratio, would have served to inhibit the development of CVD. Other dietary characteristics including high intakes of antioxidants, fiber, vitamins and phytochemicals along with a low salt intake may have operated synergistically with lifestyle characteristics (more exercise, less stress and no smoking) to further deter the development of CVD.

Nature

I don't think it did. From memory, biological anthropologists who study the diets of hunter-gatherer societies today, typically find it's about 30% meat, and goes through periods of scarcity.

It was probably similar.

Meat and organs is an almost complete food source. You’ll get sufficient vitamin D with lots of sun. Throw in berries and eggs and other foraged items and it’s a very healthy diet.

A healthy diet doesn't matter more for being fit than exercise. You can eat as healthy as you want but if you don't exercise you won't grow muscles. A person mostly eating junk food but working out regularly will be stronger, faster, and better looking.

A healthy diet is important for longevity. And if can speed up your fitness journey but it will never replace what regular exercise does.

Beaides what others said about wild berrys and plants, keep in mind that the live expectancy was 30-40 while most people didn’t even survive until their 5th year of age.
Beaides what others said about wild berrys and plants, keep in mind that the live expectancy was 30-40 while most people didn’t even survive until their 5th year of age.
Then how did people in the Bible live to be 900? /s

Check out https://www.amazon.com/Carnivore-Diet-Shawn-Baker/dp/162860350X and https://www.amazon.com/Carnivore-Code-Unlocking-Returning-Ancestral/dp/035846997X/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=1MAORNKKPSQCA&keywords=carnivore+book&qid=1686982290&sprefix=carnivore+book%2Caps%2C203&sr=8-3.

All nutritionists you need are in animal products and people who exclusively eat them are thriving.

Check out https://www.amazon.com/Carnivore-Diet-Shawn-Baker/dp/162860350X and https://www.amazon.com/Carnivore-Code-Unlocking-Returning-Ancestral/dp/035846997X/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=1MAORNKKPSQCA&keywords=carnivore+book&qid=1686982290&sprefix=carnivore+book%2Caps%2C203&sr=8-3.

All nutritionists you need are in animal products and people who exclusively eat them are thriving.

Check out https://www.amazon.com/Carnivore-Diet-Shawn-Baker/dp/162860350X and https://www.amazon.com/Carnivore-Code-Unlocking-Returning-Ancestral/dp/035846997X/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=1MAORNKKPSQCA&keywords=carnivore+book&qid=1686982290&sprefix=carnivore+book%2Caps%2C203&sr=8-3.

All nutritionists you need are in animal products and people who exclusively eat them are thriving.

Your premise is wrong, our diet has never consisted pretty much only of meat. We were hunter-gatherers, gatherer being a very important part of that phrase.

The diet of the earliest hominins was probably somewhat similar to the diet of modern chimpanzees: omnivorous, including large quantities of fruit, leaves, flowers, bark, insects and meat.

https://www.nature.com/scitable/knowledge/library/evidence-for-meat-eating-by-early-humans-103874273/

Evidence for Meat-Eating by Early Humans | Learn Science at Scitable

The first major evolutionary change in the human diet was the incorporation of meat and marrow from large animals, which occurred by at least 2.6 million years ago.

Mmmmmm... nothing gets me hungry like the thought of squirming insects!
Balance between eating and activity
physical labor, it has nothing to do with meat (which you shouldn't eat if you value your health or like dogs)
What does liking dogs have to do with eating meat lol
You trying to tell me you don't like dog meat?
Meat isn't poison, and in most cultures almost never comes from dogs. I'm a vegan myself, but your arguments sound ridiculous.
I've never seen a photo of a fit caveman.
Pppsh. Everyone knows Encino Man is an accurate representation of a caveman body.