Mastodawn

To anyone b*tching about Biden being our only 2024 choice.

I heard an identical argument against Hillary Clinton in 2016, it helped trump get elected, which resulted in 3 corrupt SCOTUS justices installed, ROE overturned, LGBTQ/TRANS Rights attacked, gerrymandering, botched pandemic response, Jan 6 insurrection & the endless mounting pile of manure we’re still dealing with & republicans are getting away with because you weren’t happy with the presidential candidate.

THREAD 🧵

We can’t afford purity tests right now.

I get it, I know you want younger & more progressive choices but in this moment in history we’re at a crossroads & these are our choices, trump or Biden.

You have seen what 4 years of trump did.

trump is a criminal traitor who shouldn’t be allowed to run for any government office to begin with & he should be in jail but alas, republicans in their infinite wisdom deemed trump better equipped than meatwad Ron DeSantis as their 2024 presidential candidate.

Our choice is clear:

4 more years of trump.

or

4 more years of Biden.

You don’t have to like Biden.

You just have to vote for Biden.

#BidenHarris2024

RudyDoesBooks Apr 30, 2023

@Lady_Star_Gem Yeah, did that already. On the clearly communicated implication that Biden was only in for 4 years.

I am sick and tired of mediocre old white men and the slow walk to hell that's the best they're capable of. Our democracy won't stand four more years of either of those old men.

Wm.son Apr 30, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Lady_Star_Gem

So what would be your suggestion?

RudyDoesBooks Apr 30, 2023

@Sfwmson @Lady_Star_Gem there are no good options. But I simply refuse to stick my head in the ground and pretend voting for Biden is either a good or the only way forward.

He's not going to prevent the oncoming storm or civil war. Don't for a second fool yourself that he will.

We built this bed. But I have no interest in lying on it and being run over.

Jonathan Kamens 86 47 Apr 30, 2023

@[email protected] @Sfwmson @Lady_Star_Gem 1) Barring surprises, Biden will be the nominee.
2) Either the Dem or GOP nominee, not a 3rd-party candidate, will be elected.
3) Our country is fucked. We're talking about minimizing harm, not salvation. Any Dem pres will minimize harm more than any Repug.
4) Refusing to vote for the Dem is the same as voting for the GOP.
These are the realities we're stuck with. Ignoring then means you are, indeed, sticking your head in the ground.
*plonk*

Holly O’Reagan May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Sfwmson @Lady_Star_Gem Rudy is clearly cis het and white and can’t be bothered by the harm that a GOP presidency will do to marginalized people like, oh, her, and others. She’s gonna die on the Bernie hill like Brie Brie and Vergil and the rest of the Dirtbag left.

Alexander Portnoy 🌊 🏳️‍🌈May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Sfwmson @Lady_Star_Gem
Your solution is to ... play the victim card?

Gwladys Pendlebury May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Sfwmson @Lady_Star_Gem Good for you speaking the truth, in the face of hypocrisy and belligerence. I was hoping for a single comment objecting to the same lazy rhetoric and you get the prize. Thank you.

Gwladys Pendlebury May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Sfwmson @[email protected] Let’s all root to re-elect a weak leader with low approval ratings in the face of fascism, because that’s what happened in Germany. Brilliant.

Wm.son May 1, 2023

@GwladysPendlebury

You didn't answer the question, though. You expanded on your previous point, which is fine, we have a clearer understanding of your POV. But what is your alternative to the situation? Just do nothing? I mean sure, you can and probably will, but that's not creating any change at all.

Wm.son May 1, 2023

@GwladysPendlebury

Also, your page indicates a socialist view and you have strong support for Ukraine. How will allowing Trump (or whoever in the GOP) help Ukraine?

Gwladys Pendlebury May 1, 2023

@Sfwmson Your argument is both lazy and ignorant to assume I didn’t and don’t resign myself to voting to the lesser of two evils because I’m a socialist. Obama was not believed to be the strongest candidate against Clinton by the party and he won huge. He had more charisma and better policies. You don’t have to promote a candidate with weak public support as the single option well before an election.

Wm.son May 1, 2023

@GwladysPendlebury

I see. Thank you. I appreciate the added insults. 🫤

Gwladys Pendlebury May 1, 2023

@Sfwmson Typical. You insult and disparage other people and then are offended when people act in kind. The original post was a jab at leftists, total bs, but a jab. Then when someone disagrees you personally double down on the jab and act offended, so you don’t have to acknowledge alternative points of view.

Wm.son May 1, 2023

@GwladysPendlebury

Fine. Didn't insult you personally, I don't believe, but have a good day.

Pie May 1, 2023

@Sfwmson My suggestion is that Democrats hold free and open primaries and the vote for the candidate that wins. In the last two presidential cycles they made it clear that wasn’t an option; a high percentage of Democrats would stay home and leave fascism unopposed rather than vote for someone to the left of an Eisenhower Republican.

Pie May 1, 2023

@Sfwmson
I campaigned to end gerrymandering in MI. Worked call centers & knocked on doors. Also attended a meeting at the local Dem hdqtrs where they opposed the proposal. They preferred to stick with their decades old losing strategy in hopes of maybe winning & gerrymandering the state in their favor. That’s how much they support democracy. They lost in big ‘20 but the proposal passed big & in ‘22 they won. All the Dem policies in MI today should be credited to the leftists who got them here.

Gwladys Pendlebury May 1, 2023

@Sfwmson if you think saying I will probably do nothing and then claim that I will stand by and allow fascists to come to power based on a glance at my profile as not personal insult, I shudder to think how you stereotype and condescend to other’s in your day to day encounters.

ZombiePete 🇺🇦Apr 30, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Lady_Star_Gem Waaaah! I don't want vanilla ice cream! I want tutti frutti! Well, because I don't get my favorite flavor, I'll make sure everyone has to eat Drano with bits of broken glass in it!

Eppy NWS Apr 30, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Lady_Star_Gem

Our weird militarized republic has survived far worse than Joe Biden.

It survived Jackson, Buchanon, Nixon, Reagan...

The problem is that a fuck ton of people that weren't Rich WASPs or boring/white enough to pretend to be WASPs didn't.

Your response REEKS of "well, I'm not getting the thing _I_ wanted so it's all the same to ME so why bother!?" which is the grossest American WASP stinger/zinger I've ever read on this damn site...

RudyDoesBooks Apr 30, 2023

@EppyNWS @Lady_Star_Gem Oh Eppy. This poor Jewish woman would really like to invite you to do something entirely impolite to yourself.

The thing I want is to not descend into Gilead. To not fear for my life. For blacks, latinx, Asians, trans folks, gay folks, to not fear for their lives.

How do you think, by all that you hold holy, Biden will make us safe? And why do you think Biden can do that? What has done over the past two years to make you think that?

Not being Trump isn't enough. It will not keep me and mine safe.

Eppy NWS Apr 30, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Lady_Star_Gem There is a MASSIVE difference between "might not do enough to keep me safe" and "Will actively antagonize and seek to hurt me and mine and cheer on his ra_ist followers while making promises to absolve them of consequences" and DONT YOU DARE PRETEND YOU DONT FUCKING KNOW IT.

And if you try and drag us into the oppression Olympics gis faggot will GLEEFULLY lob the orange from the Seder plate at your head in hopes it makes you trip.

RudyDoesBooks Apr 30, 2023

@EppyNWS @Lady_Star_Gem

Again I ask, May Susannah Hersehl haunt your life, what the fuck has Biden actually done to STOP ""Will actively antagonize and seek to hurt me and mine and cheer on his ra_ist followers while making promises to absolve them of consequences""

No, Biden will absolutely not spur followers to mass violence. but yes, Biden will absolutely, AS PROVEN BY HIS TRACK RECORD, do absolutely fuckall to stop it.

And in case you haven't noticed, Trump doesn't have to be President to do all that. He does it all now.

AND BIDEN HAS DONE FUCKALL TO STOP OR PREVENT OR UNDO THE DAMAGE or make any of safer

Sorry to pour the manischewitz all over your false feelings of safety. But you are clearly delusional. Have you read the news at any point in the two years? or two weeks??

Tonydunc May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @EppyNWS @Lady_Star_Gem Biden is operating within the standard political frameworks Trump, MAGA and related fanatics consider those to be unecesary binders and operate on either side of the legal structure they feel that they can get away with. That is undeniable dangerous. In 1932, rhe comnunists correctly described social democrats as being traitors to the working class and refused a united front against the NAZI’s. That did not play out well

Ω 🌍 Gus Posey Apr 30, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks What does "clearly communicated implication" mean? He was elected, he's been doing a great job, and now has a chance to run again. I feel like I must have misunderstood you because it sounds like you're suggesting that you won't vote for anyone. I'd like to suggest that if you're worried about women's rights and democracy, voting is more critical than ever.

RudyDoesBooks Apr 30, 2023

@Gustodon Gus, I;m 55 years old, been politcally active my whole life and ran for office in 2020. I don;t need anyone to tell me when voting is important.

And your post, by the way, is a great to tell me you are a cis het white man in the upper middle class without telling me any of that. I'm a freelance 55 year old Jewish possessor of a uterus and NO, he has not been doing a great job. My rights to exist are more endangered now than two years ago.

We are fucked. utterly fucked. Biden was never capable of unfucking us, and the last two years have shown that. He does not have what it takes for us to survive the oncoming storm.

Ω 🌍 Gus Posey Apr 30, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks Apparently you do. This category of thinking is a huge part of the problem; conservatives are counting on you.

@RudyDoesBooks @Gustodon Clearly you are looking for a king or queen, not a President. Biden is doing what he can within the scope of the constitution and our divided government. He got an extraordinary amount of good done with the slightest congressional majority. You wanted him to fix SCOTUS? Gun laws? Reinstate Roe? No president can do that alone. We need to re-elect Biden with large congressional majorities in order to get things done.

➡ [email protected]May 1, 2023

@dschwarz The problem is Biden promised to win the Senate last time, and failed. That was the time that mattered. The Senate map is far more difficult for Dems to make progress on this time around.

I'm with @RudyDoesBooks, we're fucked. Biden isn't convincing me that he's going to save democracy for real this time around when he's already done practically nothing to stop fascism right now.

Cappiello May 1, 2023

@smitten @RudyDoesBooks @dschwarz What does 'win the Senate' mean? Dem caucus, against odds, has had control since 2021. Thank you, GA.

The choice is most likely going to be Biden or Trump. If you don't like fascism, is there even a question of who to vote for?

➡ [email protected]May 1, 2023

@cappiello @RudyDoesBooks @dschwarz
'controlled' it but got stymied by Manchin and Sinema multiple times and barely could pass anything. breaking even wasn't enough, Republicans are likely to retake it now in 2024.

Im not in a swing state so it doesn't matter who I vote for, I'm assuming from your bio you're in CA so it's the same. knowing we're fucked is helpful though because it's good reason to prepare in other ways.

Cappiello May 1, 2023

@smitten @RudyDoesBooks @dschwarz

Dems were really lucky to have even had that slim majority. What was passed exceeded any 2020 expectations by quite a lot. Of course it's not enough, but in context, it's a ton.

Yes, Rs are favored to gain control. It's a rough map for Ds. Doesn't make it any less important that Biden get reelected.

Don't you think the popular vote matters? It's nothing concrete, unfortunately, but I think it matters quite a bit.

➡ [email protected]May 1, 2023

@cappiello @RudyDoesBooks @dschwarz
I will give him credit for outperforming in the midterms. but that could also have been backlash from Roe v Wade being dismantled there's no real way to know.

I would prefer Trump lose for sure but I don't think we should be under any misunderstanding that that will mean fascism is beaten back.

No I don't care about the popular vote it's not real. But that is not a well received opinion so I don't really spend much time arguing it.

Cappiello May 1, 2023

@smitten @RudyDoesBooks @dschwarz Agree on the first two points. The most important part of reelecting Biden may just be buying time to continue the fight. Especially if it's just veto time.

Doesn't really seem very important to convince someone on the popular vote. It's brought up constantly, though, in arguments. It's psychological. It's optics. Is it even opinion? It matters. Gore, Clinton pop vote mattered. Biden's large margin of victory mattered.

Havyhh2 May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Gustodon @dschwarz
Amazing that so many Americans so fundamentally misunderstand how our system of gov't works. @[email protected] clarifies it perfectly. 2024 in many ways is a simple, binary choice....Dems to go forward & continue to address American issues, GOP to go backward in every conceivable way.

Scenario May 1, 2023

@dschwarz @RudyDoesBooks @Gustodon @ChrisBoese You make the same miscalculation as most others, that no other Democrat would have been more effective.

Voron May 1, 2023

@dschwarz @RudyDoesBooks @Gustodon @ChrisBoese I worked hard to get Biden & Dems Elected, they held the house, the senate & the White House. And before people say “oh but Manchin” there have been administrations who have over come more than one or two difficult legislators.
Breaking the railway strike was a mistake.
Not pushing for a windfall profit tax was a mistake.
Not banging the bully pulpit about Fox News & Jan 6th is a mistake.
Dropping BLM & law enforcement reform etc

@voron @RudyDoesBooks @Gustodon @ChrisBoese >there have been administrations who have over come more than one or two difficult legislators.

Name them and give specific examples of votes. The Presidents we revere for their command of the Senate, such as Lyndon Johnson, were operating with substantial D majorities. Biden was operating with a 50/50 Senate where one D was bought off by lobbyists and another was from a Trump+40 coal state.

LindaNYC2VT Ⓥ 🌊🐖🐄🐓🦃🐬🐝🦋🦇May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Gustodon 🤦🏽‍♀️ that’s the type of thinking that got us into the catastrophe of the trump presidency* - and continuing on with it will help trump back into office which will be beyond catastrophic for the country and the world. But do keep whining about how your particular need just isn’t being met by Joe Biden.

David Conrad Apr 30, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Lady_Star_Gem "clearly communicated... implication" Was it communicated, or was it only implied? Communicated by whom? Implied by whom?

Holly O’Reagan May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Lady_Star_Gem so what would you suggest? There are no other choices. Oh wait. It doesn’t matter to you because you aren’t a marginalized person who won’t be harmed.

RiaResists May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Lady_Star_Gem I would like someone more progressive
We have Joe Biden who is a decent man and a good president.
We don’t know a lot what’s going on with the crooks on the right & every part of govt corrupted right now.
Please send a positive message. Encourage ppl to vote, take action.
We will never do better if we bitch.

RudyDoesBooks May 1, 2023

@Lady_Star_Gem @RiaResists

Oh, you should block me. I bitch, complain, agitate, protest, scream, canvass, persuade, fight like mad about all the things. There’s no room in this life for toxic positivity

BlueDot🇺🇦May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks
As a rule, no one accuses me of toxic positivity. I'm generally the one pointing out scary reality.

Biden wasn't my first choice in the 2020 Iowa caucuses, he wasn't in my top three. But after he won the nomination, I voted Democratic. Because the only other option is #fascism.

It sucks that we don't have #RankedChoiceVoting yet, but we will never get it under fascism, so we all have to suck it up.

@Lady_Star_Gem @RiaResists

https://left-tusk.com/@BlueDot/110249253626801632

BlueDot🇺🇦 (@[email protected])

Content warning: US politics

Mastodon

RiaResists May 1, 2023

@BlueDot @RudyDoesBooks @Lady_Star_Gem
If it has to boil down to anything it’s that.
I think Biden is doing reasonably good job.

RiaResists May 1, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Lady_Star_Gem
Its not “toxic positivity”.
It’s adulthood. Responsibility.
Your choice to behave that way must serve something in you bc it only makes things in the real world worse.

Big Head Tales Apr 30, 2023

@Lady_Star_Gem
Because everyone has to realize that #Republicans will vote for whoever the #GOP orders them to, no matter how incompetent, corrupt, or evil.

They’ve proven it time and time again, every election, every level, no matter what.

If Biden is the nominee, we have to support him.

(In fairness, I think he does a great job, but I’m concerned about his age and would like to see some new leadership I. Washington)

Geeden_Of_Arden Apr 30, 2023

@bigheadtales @Lady_Star_Gem Every GOP candidate with institutional support is a tool of the fascist minority that pursues control at all costs, imo. They have Congress and SCOTUS pretty well locked up, it seems to me.

Scenario Apr 30, 2023

@Lady_Star_Gem @bigheadtales I will vote for neither.

Wm.son Apr 30, 2023

So, should Trump win, how will you feel?

Scenario Apr 30, 2023

@Sfwmson I would feel the same as I do today: That the Dems knowingly ran a spineless octogenarian with dementia against the fascist traitor they were too weak to imprison, when much younger and bolder candidates are available. Candidates who are willing to run on an anti-corruption platform.

Big Head Tales Apr 30, 2023

@scenario @Sfwmson
Interesting.

Sounds to me like #Republican propaganda accounts are sprouting up on Mastodon. I heard the same crap from the Bernie Bros and the Green Party. All fascist propaganda.

Goodbye Scenario.

RudyDoesBooks Apr 30, 2023

@scenario @Sfwmson should Biden win, how will you feel?

Do you think your rights will be safe? Do you think he will prevent women from being enslaved by biology? That trans kids and their parents will be safe? That Jews and Asians will be safe? That citizens with guns wont mow down Black boys and men in the streets, that cops won't join them? That minor crimes won't lead to a very short and brutal life in prison? That you will be able to afford your life,, or medical care?

What do you think Biden will do to keep Americans safe? What do you think he's done in the last two years that lets you feel safe?

I don't see anything in his portfolio that made me safer now than I was two years ago.

Scenario Apr 30, 2023

@RudyDoesBooks @Sfwmson Exactly. Gun violence is up 32% on Biden’s watch. Mostly because he still thinks it’s 2010 and that Republicans will “come around.” MAGA knows this too, and they’ve become experts at duping career politicians. Meanwhile Biden refuses to use EOs that might get challenged in court, because, heh, he didn’t last 50 years in politics by making waves.

So the real question is: What other Democrat would be more effective?

And the answer is: Most of them.

Lorq Von Ray Apr 30, 2023

@Lady_Star_Gem - Last time I checked Joe Biden hasn't been traumatizing us daily with tweets about misogyny, privilege, and hate while secretly loathing the people who support him. Hey, he's not a great president but he's an okay guy so far and none of his cabinet members appear to be greedy, fascist, or just plain crazy. So yeah, I'm in.

Red Shirt Dude Apr 30, 2023

@Lady_Star_Gem If #tRunt gets back in, He. Will. Never. Leave.

Danette 🐬Apr 30, 2023

@Lady_Star_Gem I was just going to post something about this. As long as we have the electoral college (and it isn’t going anywhere soon), we have to recognize that we have to keep the Democrats together.

RudyDoesBooks Apr 30, 2023

@Lady_Star_Gem I just read through the last 20 or so of your posts leading up to this one. Really interesting.

Please tell me how Biden made life better in all of those scenarios.

Joshua Collins Apr 30, 2023

@Lady_Star_Gem A shame that either way, migrants will continue to be killed at the border