Aaron RosenbergDec 24, 2022
poswald

I’ve been thinking a lot about @noahpinion depiction of “the shouting class” in 2017 http://noahpinionblog.blogspot.com/2017/06/the-shouting-class.html

It’s particularly relevant to the #QuoteToot debate and the problems outlined are perhaps what OG mastodon people are trying to avoid.

I’ve seen a few shouting class members come and start complaining about things (including mastodon itself) and it doesn’t go well. #ShoutingClass #QuoteTweet #qt

The Shouting Class

In response to the tragic Portland stabbing , I wrote a Twitter thread praising the two men who died defending Muslim women on a train....

Dec 24, 2022 at 1:37pmMammoth
Show threadBarbaraKB in MichiganDec 24, 2022
@poswald @noahpinion how is it not “going well?” I think it’s a good discussion. But I can also understand why others have made up their minds and are likely tired of the discussion. I see some aspect of #quotetweet coming to Mastodon. But I believe there will also be a strong opt out or blocking as well.
Show threadposwaldDec 24, 2022

@barbarakb not going well in that I see shouting class members coming here to shout at mastodon users as they do on Twitter and there’s a culture clash. This has been a (mostly) positive space but the shouting class agitate and aren’t satisfied by definition.

One example I see is baiting posts from Twitter refugees about how “mastodon sucks because of x” and then performative blocking of “mansplainers” who offer advice or describe their own experience.

Show threadBarbaraKB in MichiganDec 24, 2022
@poswald I’m digesting your term of “shouting class” and now need to understand what you mean by “mansplainers?” I think you are referring to Taylor’s recent comments. Maybe it’s best to just speak to what she said directly instead of around it?
Show threadElizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾Dec 25, 2022

@barbarakb @poswald I think it's clear that he's talking about the posters.

These folks often slap a label on you to kill any further discussion.

For eg, I was accused for being an "ableist" in a discussion about EVs, because the person didn't like what I said.

Yesterday, someone said I didn't respect POC views, and I reminded her that not only was I a POC but a minority from a global south country. It's silly and exhausting.

Show threadBarbaraKB in MichiganDec 25, 2022
@liztai thank you for sharing your story. lots of “shouting” is never good when one wants a true discussion. I still hope @poswald clarifies what he means and that he’s referring to Taylor. I do want to understand.
Show threadElizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾Dec 25, 2022
@barbarakb @poswald yeah I am kinda sad. Before the recent wave, it was rather nice here lol
I feel like an old fogey screaming "Get off my lawn!"
Show threadposwaldDec 25, 2022
@barbarakb @liztai I wasn’t talking about her in particular, no. Although it may apply, I just don’t know enough to say.
My point about mansplainer accusations was that it’s just one example of callout culture. I think it is a real thing women experience, and also widely over applied and used as a cudgel. And as Noah Smith explains, it can be useful to foment change!
… but it is a different culture and I think the defining feature of the QT debate.
Show threadposwaldDec 25, 2022
@barbarakb @liztai the main question is: is mastodon a home for the shouting class or not? Because tumblr had QTs and they weren’t used that way for example. The issue isn’t the feature as much as the culture.
It’s similar to CWs. I see lots of the shouting class saying “I refuse to use that” because the whole point is to shout, complain and agitate for change. They’re not going to self-censor.
Show threadElizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾Dec 25, 2022
@poswald @barbarakb yes and that upsets me. I'm in their definition, one of the classes of people that need to be protected, where we need to be given a voice ... and I am happy to use a CW. Then again, it's in the Malaysian culture to do this, so.
Show threadElizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾Dec 25, 2022
@poswald @barbarakb ah so that's the name. I don't want this people here. So far I've been called, ableist, accused of not letting the disadvantaged/POC a voice blah blah. It's very perplexing to me lol
Show threadElizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾Dec 25, 2022
@poswald @barbarakb ok I can chime in if you don't mind. I was in a "discussion" with one of the shouty ones yesterday and it was exhausting! She clearly operated from a far-left, American culture war paradigm. I tried to explain that her arguments were basically gibberish to this #malaysian but she won't have it and kept arguing on and on and on. I blocked her. I don't want anyone like that near me.
Show threadSteven T. DennisDec 24, 2022
@poswald @noahpinion Solve it by making #QT an optional feature for users. I think the future is user-customizable social media tools. Who wants overlords changing the rules on you daily based on their whims?
Show threadposwaldDec 24, 2022
@steventdennis it would have to be optional for the person being quoted to protect them... and often people don’t know they need it until they are being focused on and having a bad time. Definitely don’t want daily rule changes so a healthy debate about it is good.
Show threadElizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾Dec 24, 2022
@poswald @noahpinion great article!
Show threadBoiglenoightDec 25, 2022
@poswald @noahpinion the Shouting Class. This is a perfect label.