david robertsAs I've said a million times: reactionaries find the thought of being held accountable for their words & actions genuinely outrageous.
This shit is so funny
🐦🔗: https://twitter.com/AssBoss80085/status/1606457994757144578
This is a famous political definition of conservatism:
"Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: there must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect."
But I also think ...
...it speaks to features of the reactionary personality. Grandpa should be able to opine freely on which groups do & don't deserve basic rights, which bits of science are & aren't valid, whether half the human species should be allowed to control their own reproductive systems...
... who should & shouldn't be allowed to vote, who is or isn't going to hell, who is or isn't fully human ...
... but his kids must nonetheless smile, treat him with respect, and hand their impressionable children over to him. Hey, they're just "political opinions."
It's the individual corollary of Wilhoit's famous political definition. Interpersonal rules of decency protect but do not bind him.
Yes, everyone, I know who Wilhoit was and where the quote comes from. I was reading Crooked Timber comment threads when you people were in diapers.
oldfartjmb says FREE PALESTINE@drvolts Pah, young whippersnapper! 😀
David Slack@drvolts In college, one of my professors talked about the church as an institution that is trying to be “in the world but not of it.”
This thread makes me realize that modern conservatives seem to want to be of the world but not in it. “I belong here more than you do but also none of the rules apply to me.”
Kobe652@slack2thefuture @drvolts Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit:
There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.
There is nothing more or else to it, and there never has been, in any place or time.
— Frank Wilhoit
— Frank Wilhoit
David Mankins@drvolts I think the essay you quote and your response to it comes from two perspectives. The conservative sees politics as a separate framework, while liberals often see it in moral terms. Your own response is framed morally. I’ll bet the conservative commentator might have little problem if the grandparents were being shunned because they were a bad moral influence (for some value the conservative recognizes as moral). Having dealt with liberal/evangelical divides in the past, the Evangelicals annoy me because their moral assumptions aren’t mine and they view my choices as immoral. But if you listen to conservative, they’re reacting to what they perceive as liberal scolding — they don’t like being in the receiving end. Yes, they don’t like being held responsible for their moral choices because they don’t see them as moral choices.
ejcrotty@lain_7 @drvolts this line of thinking says they're not choosing to be awful ( racist, sexist, homophobe, etc ) - it's just how they have been their whole lives. I have a relative who felt removing confederate statues was wrong ( removing history) but that when the statue of Saddam came down it was great. Cognitive dissonance. He firmly believes he is not racist. That white supremacists love Trump does not affect him. He is defined by this quote
John Panzer@lain_7 @drvolts They don't see their "political" choices as "moral" choices because they want their moral choices to be the one choice for everybody, and therefore not a choice at all, and therefore not a moral issue. By defining things this way, they escape moral responsibility ("that's just the way it is") and thus when people call them out, they believe themselves the victim.
Spicewalla@drvolts FWIW, my experience with a few extreme narcissists in my own family has lead me to see the reactionary personality as an aspect of narcissistic personality disorder.
The NPDs I know expect more than just your Wilhoit corollary. Its not just their right to mouth off, they require the *validation* of mouthing off and being accepted for it, like an addict. Which is why its nearly impossible to shut them up. If they don't mouth off, their self-worth is jeopardized.
Rick Thoman@drvolts All elements of an authoritarian patriarchal system. If grandpa said the sky is blue today but said it was green yesterday, then that is what it was and is and shan't be questioned or disputed.
GreengordonThat's a great definition of conservatives. I also find John Kenneth Galbraith's definition accurate:
“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.”
This speaks to the character of conservatives: they are pathologically selfish. I'm not sure it's an alterable trait in many of them.
Chris Silvia@drvolts just because of political and age trends I'd expect nearly all of these cases to have progressive kids?
And liberal parents on bad terms with their liberal kids definitely exist, but they're not whining to Dennis Fucking Praeger about it...
Rufus T. Firefly@drvolts 
Yet another fascist crying about how much he's "victimized." Poor baby. How about a pacifier?
Yet another fascist crying about how much he's "victimized." Poor baby. How about a pacifier?
Quasar@drvolts This is so weird to me, I’m just so used to families where either politics aren’t discussed or people agree to disagree. I wonder if this is an especially US thing.
Matunos
Grassroots Joe@drvolts
It's quite sad in pretty much every way.
It's sad that these folks are incapable of the self reflection required to acknowledge their culpability.
It's sad that they are fully enmeshed in a media ecosystem that tells them it's every one else's fault but their own.
And it's sad how much they are hurting themselves and their kids and grandkids.
It's quite sad in pretty much every way.
It's sad that these folks are incapable of the self reflection required to acknowledge their culpability.
It's sad that they are fully enmeshed in a media ecosystem that tells them it's every one else's fault but their own.
And it's sad how much they are hurting themselves and their kids and grandkids.
Sean Finnerty@drvolts
Conservatives not letting elderly liberal parents from their grandchildren is what occurs with the QAnon/Blood-Libel conspiracy theorists because being a Democrat is enough to be fearful that the kids will be handed off to Clinton/Biden/Obama for their sweet sweet sweet Adrenochrome.
Conservatives not letting elderly liberal parents from their grandchildren is what occurs with the QAnon/Blood-Libel conspiracy theorists because being a Democrat is enough to be fearful that the kids will be handed off to Clinton/Biden/Obama for their sweet sweet sweet Adrenochrome.
Leslie 🇺🇸🌻🌈 🌊@drvolts not a single liberal grandparent has called into Dennis Prager's radio show to complain about their conservative adult kids cutting them off, really makes you think
RickG@drvolts The second headline says it all, "On the Left, it is a grave sin to abuse the Earth. Not one's parents". Oh, those awful Lefties! Deep down they are cruel! We are so pure and golden wanting to keep families together for the holidays.
If Prager has a lonely holiday, he deserves it.
NoctisEqui 🇺🇦🇵🇸🇪🇹🏳️🌈Drawing the line at espousal of Fascism is a concept they can’t seem to grasp.
@drvolts my Mom had a BA in nursing and bought Ms magazine in the 70s. Having her ask me when my daughter's husband was going to be deported and say "that gay boy will never be president" (about Buttigieg) because of Limbaugh and Fox kinda' put a damper on our relationship 🙄
Fredrich Legnemark@drvolts Being considered for social gatherings isn't a automatic thing imho. You have to be able to behave decently and human. If you were to go on hateful rants (Like conservatives and fascists often do), you will be ushered towards the door. Politely if possible, abruptly if needed.
I would say that if you cant behave and affect the family negative, you're out.
They need to learn this.
KateSaltLake
Robert Link@drvolts Prager. Oy. (I say that advisedly, having visited PragerU for temple. Double-oy.)