Lauren WeinsteinDec 11, 2022

Someone just mentioned the differences between #Twitter and #Google regarding user data. Yes, indeed.

I've worked inside #Google twice. Their explicit rules, approvals, logging and "need to know" requirements for access to user data are most impressive. Anyone even attempting to access user data inappropriately is fired and marched out the door by security. This is part of why I have a great deal of trust in Google, and consider Elon's #Twitter to be utterly untrustworthy and totally beneath contempt.

Show threadTom Stoneham

@lauren I am told by a Facebook insider that same was/is true there.

But the problem is: why do you have something in the first place if it needs such protection?

Surely true #DataPrivacy means don't collect rather than don't misuse.

Once it has been collected, the user has lost their privacy even if *you* don't misuse it. It's all about power.

Dec 11, 2022 at 6:57pmWeb
Show threadLauren WeinsteinDec 11, 2022
@tomstoneham People want to be able to message each other. All else being equal, I prefer end to end cryptography, but that is not always practical in all contexts, and brings complicated political issues into the equation that can really muddy things up.
Show threadTom StonehamDec 11, 2022

@lauren Can't think of a context where it isn't practical except SMS and email.

And the political is *exactly* why everyone must fight for it! 😝

We wouldn't tolerate 1984-style telescreens, so why tolerate similar intrusions on our digital spaces?

Show threadLauren WeinsteinDec 11, 2022
@tomstoneham The problem of course is that some governments are explicitly banning it in various contexts. On the other hand, Apple just announced that they were ending their CSAM scanning on devices project.
Show threadTom StonehamDec 11, 2022

@lauren Ever used WeChat? Client side scanning for political content there (try using an image if Winnie the Pooh in Moments). Doesn't have to be at OS level.

Best way to fight governments who want to ban something is normalise it. Make it everyday for people who didn't know they cared about it.

Show threadmarkDec 11, 2022

@tomstoneham @lauren I'm at meta, and it's true. Access is strictly regulated and tracked. You don't get to see people's data if you don't have a use for it. And if you do you are watched and logged. They keep it safe.

Maybe not altruistic, because it is their profit base.

Show threadTom StonehamDec 11, 2022
@ATLeagle @lauren
So if it needs that level of protection, time to rethink collecting it at all
Show threadLauren WeinsteinDec 11, 2022
@tomstoneham @ATLeagle Billions of people around the world want these services and depend on them. Most of these services depend on data. The issue is making sure that the data is being handled responsibly, not ending services that require data.
Show threadTom StonehamDec 11, 2022

@lauren @ATLeagle
'require'?

But that is a long conversation not suited to this medium.

Show threadLauren WeinsteinDec 11, 2022
@tomstoneham @ATLeagle Agreed this is not the best venue for such a technical discussion ...
Show threadmarkDec 11, 2022

@lauren @tomstoneham I remember the terrible treatment of consumers at the hands of the owners of communication infrastructure in the 70s and 80s . There is always a price for things people want and use.

Not defending the practices, just pointing out that they do protect well, and I agree there is more nuance than we can cover correctly in a text only forum.

Show threadLauren WeinsteinDec 11, 2022
@ATLeagle @tomstoneham The dominant telcos/ISPs have always been problematic, and have become worse over recent years.
Show threadSteveDec 11, 2022
@ATLeagle @tomstoneham @lauren
My impression is that Facebook guards user data not to protect users' privacy but because user data are the company's crown jewels of trade secrets
Show threadmarkDec 11, 2022
@Steve98052 @tomstoneham @lauren manipulation and use of the data is really the competitive advantage, but owning the data is the foundation. No one new can compete with the backstory of our lives that meta owns.
Show threadTom StonehamDec 12, 2022
@ATLeagle @Steve98052 @lauren
Unless they have a different business model?
Show threadKee HinckleyDec 11, 2022
@tomstoneham @lauren
It is definitely that way at Meta for new things. Although cleanup of privacy holes from before they locked thjngs down is an ongoing process (literally, every quarter has Privacy Waves). I declined a job in the privacy group because it seemed hellish to be caught between lawyers and legacy code.