KuechenmonkOne of the great mistakes of our time is the idea, anything in existence or thinkable can be made a good with a price.
? (cybre aspect)@Kuechenmonk the quantization of all information in terms of value. It's something I dislike as well.
@0x3F It is a shame, since it encourages or rather forces everyone to market him-/herself, to optimize, to streamline...
What I am especially worried about is the idea, all the collected data would give an accurate picture of reality.
@Kuechenmonk turning humanity into individual economic engines isn't a good idea. Ugh, the belief that with enough tech we can solve all problems really rubs me the wrong way.
@0x3F "Progress & Empire" still appear to be a valid motivation.
I wonder, how to organise society around other core principles besides debt-driven greed. What could lead out of that misery?
@Kuechenmonk i have wondered this question for long time, and i have no solution. I truly believe technology cannot give us a solution there. Humans will have to come up with some system of distribution on that scale. I hope people much smarter than me are working on i, because so far I don't even know how to approach that problem.
@0x3F Alas, I have no magic cure either. But there's a documentary, I recently watched, that gave me some insight into the ideas of selflessness, friendlyness and charity. Do you speak German or French?
@Kuechenmonk no I dont speak either of those languages, but subtitles maybe? I'll be sure to check it out.
@0x3F The idea now is to teach people to enlarge that in-group over the entire planet. If we recognise ourselves in that poor fellow on the street or the plantation in Brazil or in the factory in China, we start to act good. You cannot exploit easily those who are like you.
@Kuechenmonk I can agree with that. Just getting it to scale is the difficult part. How do we make it so people who can't speak the same language, or have the same ideas, communicate and identify with each other, recognize the other as part of our group? A fellow sufferer, a person, a friend.
@0x3F Language isn't the problem. One of the benefits of capitalism is the spread of the Enlish language. Without globalisation I doubt very much I would have been forced to learn it in school. And both of us wouldn't be having this pleasent conversation (nor the need of it, altogether). We've got a bunch of shared problems. But we can communicate. And I strongly suggest, the solution, if altruism is it, has to be implemented in a down to top manner.
@Kuechenmonk while English is the closest we've ever come to a global language, there's many people that don't speak it. These people often have entirely different perspectives and that makes them likely to be people most of the WEIRD (western, educated, industrial, rich, democratic) world would have issues with or vice versa. Communication is key and language is the strongest tool we have for that right now. What would a bottom up approach look like?
@0x3F if I am in the super market, I can decide if I want to purchase socially or ecologically problematic poroducts. I can teach other people, I can be nice, I can vote, I can demonstrate, I can support local farmers, I can support farmers abroad. I can deny (to a huge extent) consumption. I can cook for myself or others, I can go by foot or bike instead by car. And so on. It is all these little things in our direct vicinity that can be done.
@Kuechenmonk I think while all of these things are great, they're much harder to execute. Getting people to think critically about their choices and what impact it has on a large scale would require a severe shift in culture. I don't think we're incapable of it, but it won't be easy.
@0x3F Of course "doing the right thing", whatever that means, is hard. I live in Fort Europe. Nothing of the misery that was created on our behalf shall pass the borders of our little paradise. And I understand, it is very tempting to ignore the consequenses of our deeds. Who cares for people at the end of the world, as long as my shoes and my food stays cheap?