Mastodawn

@alatiera argh, how oblivious can these people be? With all the backlash and everything, I hoped they learned something.

Jordan Petridis Apr 22

@soapdog Their plan has always been to "until it blows over". They don't see anything wrong with it other than the "annoying backlash" they had.

@alatiera if they at least were plataforming and pushing for other linux distros, if other maintainers were getting machines and so on, but noooooo they have to champion mr douche there, argh.

glad I am going with MNT instead.

Alastair Temple Apr 22

@soapdog @alatiera they do send out to other distros, and given Ormachy wasn't on the list they said they had sent pre-relase laptops too. I therefore suspect they had intended for this to go under the radar which is even worse. Not only have they not actually listened, the lesson they seem to have learned is "just don't let people know". It's all so sad and frustrating and oh so easily avoidable by Framework.

@smilingdemon @soapdog @alatiera

Morten Linderud Apr 22

I think this is fine. It would be more egregious if they spent time promoting fashOS instead of any the dozen of serious distros and projects.

@Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera they do spend a lot of time promoting omarchy

@soapdog @smilingdemon @alatiera

Morten Linderud Apr 22

They did at least. When was the last time they promoted omarchy?

@Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera am not keeping track, can't tell.

@soapdog @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera So, when you said, "they spend a lot of time promoting omarchy," to what were you referring?

@komali_2 @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera they were called out for plataforming DHH, then they replied badly. That thread had more info. Is their track record better recently? I am not sure, considering they did send a device to DHH I think they simply don't care that DHH is posting that trans people are not people or that London should be more white.

@soapdog @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera Nirav, the CEO, has explicitly said he supports immigrants and LGBTQ rights, on twitter. Won't link that awful site but a quick search should turn it up.

So imo I wonder to what degree our expectations for framework change since it's a socially conscious company, vs a known-systemic-evil like dell.

@komali_2 @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera well, saying they support queer people while sending a laptop to a transphobic hater is a bit of double speech. I'd be happier if I could see them sending laptops to queer engineers as well.

@soapdog @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera

They send laptops to all the other main distros and DEs, and their 5k/year donation to Arch is functionally a direct payment to the trans community lol. They also donate thousands to debian, cachy, bazzite, nix, the bsds, kde, etc. They don't send any money directly to omarchy, unlike these other DEs and distros.

@soapdog @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera it's a sad reality but the true reality is they didn't send a laptop to DHH because he's a POS transphobe, they sent a laptop to the Omarchy lead dev because it's a very popular "distro" that for whatever reason all the content creators are focusing on, so a great entry point for new laptop buyers.

Just more sad realities under capitalism.

@komali_2 @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera

again, that normalisation of fascism is dangerous.

They can make sure it runs with Omarchy. They don't need to platform DHH, he is a fascist. Being a maintainer doesn't offload that.

Treating fascists well because they happen to be productive fascists is not good enough.

@soapdog @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera Right, this isn't the first time we've been here though. You can't participate in FOSS without gnu tooling, and yet plausible sex pest Stallman is reinstated to the FSF. OpenBSD still refuses to have a code of conduct. The linux kernel mail list was a verbally abusive hell hole until recently. Dtrace still used, and Cantrill still around, despite never really addressing his controversies.

@komali_2 @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera I am all in favour of throwing stallman into the bin as well.

You understand that quoting other bad actors, doesn't excuse DHH.

I want them all gone. Did Framework sent Stallman a laptop? I didn't see that. They sent one for DHH and that is what I am complaining about

komali_2

@soapdog @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera Right, "all gone," that's my point, it isn't really possible. That would have to include openbsd, gnome (support for AWS which supports the IDF, an existent fascist threat and genocidal entity), hyprland.

I don't think this strategy leads to creating safer communities, I think it just puts selective pressure against good actors in favor of bad ones.

That Linux Dude Dominic Hayes Apr 30

RE: https://mastodon.social/@komali_2/116448782878487828

@komali_2 @soapdog @Foxboron @smilingdemon @alatiera What do you mean 'gnome supports AWS', outta curiosity?

If anything, isn't it the opposite (Amazon supporting Gnome)?

komali_2 Apr 30

@FerenOSDev

Well they happily sing the praises of AWS and shill it, which was the original thing Framework was accused of for Omarchy (before they had actually sent over a laptop, they just just mentioned Omarchy on a blog post).

My overall point is that our community tends to engage in proximal ethics - we let the big bads get away with it because they always have, and we hyper fixate on the good guys and small actors, creating selective pressure against trying to be good.

That Linux Dude Dominic Hayes Apr 30

@komali_2 Got any sources for the AWS stuff?

Would be hypocritical to not have any given the Framework drama having an entire thread of sources linked earlier.