Mastodawn

Disappointed with Aqara - Zigbee hub, but no 3rd party?

https://sh.itjust.works/post/58071714

Disappointed with Aqara - Zigbee hub, but no 3rd party? - sh.itjust.works

Correct me if I’m wrong, but… # Buyer Beware! Aqara hubs use the Zigbee protocol, but lock out 3rd party devices! A few months ago, I bought an Aqara hub and went deep into their ecosystem. I saw their hub and sensors had good reviews, plus they were using the Zigbee open protocol, so I figured I’d stick with their stuff. I had no reason to try other devices until recently. I picked up a tilt sensor for my garage door from a 3rd party. I made sure it was also using the Zigbee protocol, so I assumed it would be compatable. Unfortunately, when I tried connecting it to the hub, I was wrong and it wouldn’t connect. Turns out, Aqara uses the Zigbee protocol, but locks out 3rd party devices. [source [https://forum.aqara.com/t/third-party-zigbee-support/1068]] If anyone has a workaround to integrate a 3rd party device with an Aqara Hub (IIRC, I have the M3?), I’d love to hear about it. But until then - I’m looking for a refund. I would have never picked up their hub if I had known about their shennanigans; and consequently, I wouldn’t have picked up so many of their sensors.

ropatrick 1d ago

Do many companies let you use their hubs to connect to devices from competitors? I always assumed of you bight X brand, you could only c9nnet to X brand.

If you are gettng a refund, would you consider using ZIGBEE2MQTT with a suitable dongle from Home Assistant, Sonoff etc.? Then you can connect your Aqara stuff and pretty much any other brand you want, without any of their hubs.

Apologies if I’m missing something subtle here but it seems normal that Aqara would want to tie you into their products only.

Ted Lemon 1d ago

@ropatrick @CocaineShrimp

This is indeed the whole point of the Thread/Matter ecosystem: to get us out of these ridiculous single-vendor-lock-in hub systems.

spitfire 1d ago

But a Zigbee coordinator with Z2M/ZHA already lets you do that. I have 126 Zigbee devices from many different vendors connected to one

Ted Lemon 1d ago

Right. The difference is that if the thing has the thread logo on it, it passed a certification that ensured that this was the case, and that's also true for Matter devices. For Zigbee it's entirely voluntary, so caveat emptor.

spitfire 1d ago

Also there are a lot more Zigbee devices on the market, usually stable and cheaper. I know it’s going to be a lot easier for „regular ” consumers to get something easily though. But the matter over WiFi vs. Thread is very confusing to a lot of people

Ted Lemon 1d ago

Any suggestions? :)

spitfire 1d ago

Any suggestions about what?

Ted Lemon 1d ago

How to explain it better? No worries if you don't, I just figured if you felt like ranting about it I wouldn't mind hearing what you have to say.

Even hue, on their own platform allows third party ZigBee devices without complaints.

Avid Amoeba 1d ago

Really? I wasn’t able to connect Ikea bulbs to my Hue hub when I still used it. 🤔

Claude Flammang 1d ago

@avidamoeba
Guess that’s the result of rewriting everything for Matter.

I haven’t tried IKEA, but osram plugs and some Danish brand switches work just fine. New stuff gets plugged directly into home assistant though (via a zonoff ZigBee dongle).

dislabled 10h ago

I’d just like to warn about the reverse way, using aqara products on a general hub. I’m running HA with z2m myself, and used to have a whole array of aqara devices. They caused me nothing but problems, so I have slowly phased them out to similar devices which actually follow the zigbee standard.

CmdrShepard49 10h ago

I have several Aqara devices, IKEA, Tuya, and others and havent experienced any issues with my Sonoff Zigbee 3.0 stick.

ropatrick 9h ago

Good point, I have hears of people having issues with Aqara stuff like that. Good flag.

dislabled 8h ago

I used to have a sonoff zigbee 3.0 stick, which was a good device. But back then I still had problems. It probably depends on how many devices you have, but for me, especially when I had a lot of aqara router devices, they took down the whole network from time to time. And they would constantly fall out of the network. I still have one socket switch left, and it triggers by turning on the light in the same room(IKEA switch). There is no automation linked for this… Only solution is to downgrade the firmware of the socket switch several versions.

CmdrShepard49 6h ago

Curious if you use a Pi and had the stick connected directly? I don’t recall the exact issue or configuration but I know some of these sticks (possibly ZWave) work better when connected through a USB cable rather than directly to the Pi

David J. Atkinson 6h ago

@CmdrShepard49 Same here. A good idea. It works.

dislabled 5h ago

Nah, I have it as a vm on a 2u server. I used to have it on a 1 metre extension also, and as soon as I changed the aqara devices, network was stable. I only changed the adapter because I wanted one on LAN.

CmdrShepard49 5h ago

I see. Maybe its just an issue with the repeaters. All mine Aqara devices are end points and the only router devices I have are IKEA repeaters.

Avid Amoeba 1d ago

This is pretty normal. Philips also uses ZigBee for Hue and you can’t connect non-Philips ZigBee devices to it. This is the major reason I started using Home Assistant. I use Home Assistant Yellow which has a built-in ZigBee radio but ZigBee radios can be added via USB to any setup running Home Assistant. ZBT-2 is pretty great for high performance unit. Sonoff have a cheaper dongle.

ropatrick 1d ago

Speaking of devices, I’m actually still using an ancient Conbee II and it’s rock solid. I thought about changing it recently and ordered a ZBT-2 for a more up to date product, but then I realised I was insane and set it up as a Thread Border Router instead, so I have both now.

Avid Amoeba 1d ago

I just got ZBT-2 for my first Matter/Thread device and hooked it up to my HA Yellow. This thing now does ZigBee, Thread and Z-Wave. 😆

ropatrick 1d ago

Winning at protocol mastery. I commend thee.

MrQuallzin 1d ago

I’ve got the Sonoff dongle and it works pretty well. I’ve got lights from ThirdReality and sensors from Aqara, ThirdReality, and Sonoff. Everything works seamlessly in Home Assistant

JelleWho 1d ago

I believe no company who makes there own hub allows 3rd parties? That’s why I have a zigbee dongle in HA

thr0w4w4y2 1d ago

Fortunately there are plenty of Zigbee dongles that are compatible with HA, and just as fortunately they will all support Aqara sensors using MQTT with very little effort.

Treczoks 1d ago

It is not per se “locking out other devices”. More likely, it does only know it’s own devices and how to use them.

When you go deep down the rabbit hole, you learn that prior to Zigbee 3.0, you’ve got all sorts of zigbee profiles (like bluetooth profiles). Two prominent ones are Zigbee Light Link (LL) and Zigbee Home Automation (HA). Hubs solely designed for Zigbee LL ecosystems don’t talk to Zigbee HA devices, and hubs designed solely for Zigbee HA ecosystems don’t talk to Zigbee LL devices.

Obligatory: xkcd.com/927/

Standards

xkcd

p4rzivalrp2 8h ago

Just to point this out for anyone seeing this thread, the aqara hubs with thread still let you use them as a thread for third party devices