VetOfTheSeasDown with gym class!
ViatorOmniumAnd the Uber will take them to right destination 99.9% of the times.
TBF I’ve probably gotten lost more times than that driving my own car.
tomiantIf everyone has one of these “automobiles” do people ever walk or run anymore
Not really, actually
Yes, but for recreation. For fun.
Oh Emmett
voidsignalsigh… how can one be so dumb?
Realistically, schools were designed to provide a trainable workforce that could read well enough to learn new tasks and do enough math to make sure the factory machines were properly maintained.
Many people these days don’t read a single book after they get out of school. The AIs are just making things happen faster.
From a broader perspective “school” has been a thing since before Socrates and humanity pendulums between “a broad education is the foundation for a strong populace” and “we need a giant pool of disposable labor”.
And the US public education philosophy is similarly inconsistent. At the earliest it was Puritans who wanted everyone to be able to read the Bible for themselves and so pushed for literacy. At times it has been guided specifically by the business economy but it’s inaccurate to say that schools were designed to produce factory workers.
Yeah, hell modern universal public education was partly a result of the working class fighting like hell for it
Modern universal public eduction has its roots in prussian model and the idea was very much to make effective and loyal workforce. Im not saying modern education has the same ulterior motivations, but things like standarized curricula and grading are coming from there.
IIRC the goal wasn’t to have a loyal workforce, but to have an army that isn’t dependent on a small number of elites.
Basically “we won’t stop with the death of our officers, our soldiers can step up to the occasion”.
On the other hand, a lot of good ideas ended up getting co-opted to serve the State.
I don’t think the IWW was planning on ahving kids learn the Pledge of Allegiance.
Nor did the inventor of the pledge expect it to be used for anti communism.
But ultimately I don’t want us to throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the public education system goes away the proletariat will suffer for it. Fascists are attempting to move the Overton window towards that. The solution as I see it is re-examining, reimagining, and reforming public education to serve the masses. But a big part of that is reconvincing the proletariat that education is valuable in its own right rather than just as job training.
Hear, hear!
MissJinxThe statement is dumb but I it does have a hint of true. With new technologies comes a new way of life and this should be reflected in education. The traditional educational system was created when no technologies existed and children and parents lifes were very different.
That’s why every kid has “ADHD”. They live in a different reality! siting down in a class for hours listening to a boring class and then having a test on what was said does not fill todays kids needs anymore. The global traditional.school system needs an urgent upgrade
That’s why every kid has “ADHD”. They live in a different reality! siting down in a class for hours listening to a boring class and then having a test on what was said does not fill todays kids needs anymore. The global traditional.school system needs an urgent upgrade
FiniteBanjoThe people who don’t respect the value of school generally performed very poorly in school.
We mature too late in life to realize thats the last time anyone will ever teach us for free.
MalReynoldsLife is teaching you all the time (for free) if you but listen.
Especially if you’ve learned to learn, and have critical thinking, things schools should be teaching (but often avoid in favor of quickly outdated ‘job skills’ or similar because some political ideologies do better with the poorly educated).
They do have a point. School should be about learning and developing critical thinking skills rather than memorizing who the 30th president was.
I know my schooling had a ton of memorization. Funny to think about now that I know I have Aphantasia because I always excelled in math and science because they are less about memorization and more about learning a concept to apply.
They need to teach kids how to use AI. It’s like people that won’t let you use a calculator in math. “You aren’t always going to have a calculator in your pocket”
I’ve always been a big supporter of open book/note tests
There is no reason I should be able to recite as much of the Canterbury Tales as I can.
IteriaFacts are how you build up everything else. It pretty hard to reason about complex math if you don’t understand how to count to 100. It’s pretty hard to reason about how societies move in waves and cycles if you don’t memorize something about history.
I think people don’t understand that you don’t just start doing abstract work. You build it a bunch of facts that you memorize and then you can start building higher level things like patterns and abstractions.
I know this from trying to teach my child basic concepts like what money is. What exactly is a day. How magnet work. The entire concept of estimation. These are trivial to adults, but these are hard won concepts that were build from concrete ideas for my child.
We know this is necessary because of cultures that are missing whole concepts like particular colors. The idea of right and left. So on.
AzzuCounting to 100 is like learning to read. Yes both are basic tools needed to learn English or math.
Do I need to know that the Ming Dynasty ruled from 1368 to 1644? Is anything about the Ming Dynasty relevant to my life? I cannot remember the other handful of dynasties so I guess the Ming Dynasty could be the only one needed to function.
Yes history is important and definitely worth telling people. But having them memorize stuff that you can look up in a textbook is dumb.
I could walk into any high school level history class and pass the test if it was open book and if I had enough time I’d probably find all the answers.
Anyone couldn’t walk into a Calculus class and pass the test with it being open book if they didn’t know how to do Calculus. Yes they could read the whole chapter and learn to do it then pass the test. But there’s no looking up the answers in the book. It’s not memorizing.
We know this is necessary because of cultures that are missing whole concepts like particular colors. The idea of right and left. So on.
Cultures are not missing whole concepts like particular colors or left and right. They just express it differently.
Light red is pink. But a light blue is still light blue, maybe baby blue or sky blue.
Russia has the word голубой for light blue. It’s equivalent to our pink. Are we missing the whole concept of light голубой? No.
The cultures understand them being a different color and even more so they understand how it’s a mix or part of a color group. Being able to point and say “orange” when equal red and yellow are mixed isn’t a necessary skill. Like what would you say if something was a mixture of equal parts green and yellow? You could say chartreuse. If you didn’t know that word are you really missing out on everything chartreuse?
The right and left thing I think you’re referring to the tribe that uses cardinal directions? Thinking in terms of cardinal directions instead of left or right is a bit bizarre and I don’t know exactly how deep it goes. Like if i wanted to tell you to hang the picture to the right of the fireplace, I would have to know the cardinal directions of your house? Cardinal directions are extremely useful to use in English. East side wall of your house tells you exactly what wall it is. Left or right doesn’t mean anything unless I say something like “facing your house”. If I knew your fireplace was on your north wall I could easily say “Hang the picture east of your fireplace” meaning hang it to the right.
Nope, this is a common thought amongst those impressed by AI. And I can relate coz when I was in school, no one would give a good answer to why I needed to do any arithmetics without a calculator.
A_norny_mousseI think it’s reactionary, too. A version of “anything to trigger the libs”. If so many people weren’t against AI, OOP might have taken a moment to think before they type. As it stands, they reached for the first hot argument to get their opinion out. And I don’t mean to absolve them from anything here, just analyzing.
As a math teacher, my suggestion to the students is during practice to try to do calculations without a calculator to invoke a bit of number sense so when they use calculators be able to notice in the result if they did a wrong input. It happens to input “14” instead of “41” . I feel like able to do mental arithmetic with double digit numbers can be helpful
In hindsight, I do think the right approach is not to use calculators till secondary school (about 14~15 years of age). Having a feel for numbers and how they should behave under addition/multiplication/exponentiation, and ability to mentally do two digit calculations as you said is critical
When they filmed the movie ‘Van Helsing’ in Prague they needed one hundred couples who knew how to ballroom dance. Everyone thought this was going to be difficult to set up, but it turned out that literally every extra they hired could waltz. Back in Soviet days, the country didn’t have a lot of money for sports equipment, but every school had a record player. They taught the kids ballroom dancing for the Physical Education requirement.
𝔄 𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔱𝔦𝔢𝔫𝔱 𝔭𝔦𝔢𝔠𝔢 𝔬𝔣 𝔠𝔥𝔢𝔢𝔰𝔢We went to dance classes all throughout I think eight grade and learned a few of the classical dances. Waltz, Foxtrott, Cha-Cha, Tango. That’s Eastern Germany in the early 2000s.
Now I’m imagining Mel Brooks doing a black-and-white German Expressionist scene of nine year olds in tuxedos and gowns doing the tango.
Dance classes in a normal secondary school? Wow, we never had that. We had a private dance school for couple dancing in town, many kids did that at about age 13 (I think it was a minimum age thing).
It wasn’t in school, it was an after school thing at a dancing school. It was relatively affordable - I think it was at least in part paid for by the ministry of education - and we all went there together after regular lessons. I never heard of anyone not attending.
My middle school made us learn to waltz in gym class. I’m ass at it, but it was fun.
Street clothes or gym shorts?
jqubedMy elementary school PE did a couple weeks every year where we did square dancing and line dancing. I guess that’s the southeastern US coming in. Sometimes we did some other more traditional English dance where the boys and girls would be in rows facing each other where there were some set steps and then the couple at one end would dance down between the lines to the other end, there would be more steps and then the next couple would move, and so on. It was like something out of a Jane Austen movie.
I learned square dancing in high school in Ohio. I was the only boy in a class of all girls, because I had broken my wrist and couldn’t play basketball. I would love to tell the story of how this helped me get girls, but I was much too big of a loser to take advantage of the situation.
You can thank Henry Ford’s racism for that.
No, really. He hated seeing his employees dance to jazz (which he blamed on Jewish people, because of course he did) so much that he pushed to have “proper” dances taught in public schools, dances that were old-fashioned even in his time.
Every kid in Scotland is taught how to ceilidh. Some of us even learn to enjoy it!
JusticeForPorygonWhat the fuck man I got told off for six years because I didn’t know how to jump rope
I mean I also got publicly humiliated by my inability to run far or fast so often it fucked with my head. But we had 6 months of learning to dance before returning to the shame gauntlet
Ah so, it’s not only Finland where the point of Physical Education is to humiliate all the joy of athletics out of generations of people.
Except the up and coming hockey players the washed up sportsman/woman who was hired to teach as a sort of social program gives all their attention to. Guess those have different sports abroad.
But really it seems so efficient that the state makes schools focus on competition, subsidize competitive team sports heavily, and hire people from professional sports to further the subsidized hobbies of the maybd future professionals.
The end result is billions in subsidies and that most people who can’t hack it professionally just quit sports alltogether in their teens or even earlier.
I just quite can’t see how are they actually trying to go public health first with which the tax expenses are excused.
Yeah I get what my schools were going for. And it was private school, so while taxes pay for actually a worse version by all accounts, my parents paid for mine.
Like, they tried to have a variety of things within budget. We did calisthenics, we did sports like basketball, flag gridiron football, and even occasionally some international football, we had American classics like dodgeball. In high school we even did pickleball and weight lifting.
But at the end of the day I got winded after a few meters of running and so running a mile (1069m) as is something most people were expected to be able to do was an exercise in me exhausting myself and slowly trudging along after everyone else finished. Fortunately I’ve always been really strong for my exercise level so for strength type stuff I regained some of the dignity I lost being lapped by fat smokers.
The thing is, nothing will ever make running something I’m willing to do if I can help it. I get the runners high and still hate running. And it would be an expensive disaster if schools did my preferred cardio of bikes or hikes. But also they didn’t even teach us proper running form. They just assumed “people know how to run, and the weird nerd won’t be athletic anyways”. Fortunately I’ve become fairly athletic in adulthood (though I fell out for a year and a half and am now hurting getting back into it)
Is this where I subscribe for more Van Helsing facts?
To graduate from my (American) high school, you needed a given number of gym points, and you were given one gym point per day of gym class. But, I learned, you earned one and a half gym points per day of dance class! I figured this was a great scam: I already hated gym class, so I’d get my points out the way faster.
Fast forward a couple of months, and I’m working harder than I ever was in gym class, I’m enjoying myself more, and I’m hanging out with girls in leotards first thing every school day. There was literally no downside.
Clearly, the system working as intended.
Not just Soviet days. Today, it’s expected (although not mandatory) to attend a course on ballroom dance and etiquette around the age of 16. It’s usually not in school PE classes, but evening lessons in dedicated ballrooms or community centers with professional lecturers.
There are also similar courses for adults commonly available. It’s considered a fun hobby for couples.
I was lucky enough to go to a summer camp where we learned dance.
I think a lot of my fellow americans would benefit from learning etiquette and dancing.
Sundray“Don’t let AI write anything for you. Writing is to cognitive health what steps are to physical health”
(via)
We can’t have people forming their own ideas.
Zachariah
Dumhuvud
bonenode