Eugen RochkoMachine translations are often brought up as a gotcha whenever I criticize LLMs. It's worth pointing out two things: Machine translations existed decades before LLMs, and yes, machine translations are useful. However: I would never in my life read a machine translated book. Understanding what a social media post is talking about in rough terms? Sure. Literature? Absolutely not. Hell, have you ever seen machine translated subtitles? It's absolute garbage.
I have the impression that primarily anglophone people don't read as much translated literature, because so much good literature already exists in their language, so this issue may not be as familiar within that demographic. As someone who did not grow up anglophone, I can tell you there is a world of difference between a good and a bad translation even when done by humans. Machine translations are not even on the scale.
From what I've observed, people who claim that LLMs can replace artists don't understand art, people who claim that they can replace musicians don't understand music, people who claim that they can replace writers don't understand literature, and people who claim they can replace translators don't rely on translations. If I had a button that would erase LLMs from the world but it would take machine translations away (which is a false dichotomy anyway), I would absolutely still press it.
Technology is not inevitable. We've decided not to have asbestos in our walls, lead in our pipes, or carginogenic chemicals in our food. (If you're going to argue that it's not everywhere, where would you rather live?) We could just not do LLMs. It's allowed.
Tekchip@Gargron would you know if you've seen a good outcome of an LLM? You'd somehow be able to identify when the LLM got it right?
I assure you you've experienced good LLM output and don't even know it. Because that's what good LLM output looks like. Indistinguishable from human output.
Your examples are perhaps false equivalencies. Take asbestos. We didn't abolish insulation. We developed better, safer insulation. We didn't stop dying food colors, we just developed safer dyes etc.
@Gargron ultimately LLMs like any other software is a tool. It's all about how a human uses them.
Lets take photoshop as an example. Humans generate vast amounts of garbage photoshopped images. Ever been to deviant art?
And yet the same tool is used by professionals all day every day to create stuff we like and enjoy.
The same applies to LLM use, and back to my first reply. What you lament is low quality output a human shared. Meanwhile the tool gets used masterfully to great effect elsewhere
❣️u.s. pause federal tax remittances@melioristicmarie @Gargron okay, sure, maybe my toots are slop. So...what? I should be deleted as the OP implied of LLMs? How about all those folks making mediocre art over on deviant art? Disappear them too?
That's a bit of a moral quandary isn't it? How do we get the good stuff without the bad stuff?
You stand to make the world perfect if you can figure that out. I look forward to it.
human, is fine. perfection is a scam sold by ponzi schemers who have no useful skill. second sons of the british empire looking for some purpose that makes daddy approve of their existence.
maybe... just maybe... talk to a human and ask them how you can help them, with your actual meat space body. then maybe you could find some meaning in life instead of trying to get techbros to think you are pretty.
@Tekchip my walls are full of art by humans that some would call terrible... who the fuck cares? they have love and craft and pain and power from the hands and soul of a human creator. they are beautiful. i fucking love bad art.
slop generation is the nothingness.
just write your toot from your heart, fuck the machine. being human is fine.
@Gargron
ClipHead@ClipHead @melioristicmarie @Gargron which this?
"there is no value in the average."
or
"my walls are full of art by humans that some would call terrible... who the fuck cares?"
Can't have it both ways.
@Tekchip
so... is this a slop account? am i tooting with cheapgpt?
are you a human playing with toys you do not comprehend?
dear dogs, may i have the confidence of a mediocre "white" man.
so... l.l.m.s tokenize english text... and then calculate an average.
humans making shitty art is qualitatively perfection in comparison to word salad from a calculator. when you enter this into wannabe deep seek... i will be waiting with bated breath for the token response. ; )
@melioristicmarie @ClipHead @Gargron lol are you an LLM or just don't care to review my profile? Shoot even do a google search. I'm easy to find. Seems like you've lost the plot.
@Tekchip
There's no point in explaining, if you don't get "this", tbh.
The ServitorThere's also the problem of your essentialist thinking that decides only terrible human beings could find any value in LLMs, because use of LLMs is proof of same. QED. It's like thinking poor people must be morally bankrupt. It's a non-sequitur.
Anti-LLM posts quickly turns to deep pronouncements about the personality and motives of people who do things you don't like, not an honest discussion of the harms of the tech, because it's a purity test, not a position.
@TheServitor another cheapgpt word salad... bankrupt of meaning.
quality... qualitative difference.
those who boost calculator speak are emotionally deficient. as a society, in overdeveloped regions running the rat race of shareholder value, snake oil salesman is the job that the most vulnerable fall into, the men who have lost the plot likely because disruptive masculinity has violently warped their soul; the norm, the average, the most common... is what those deficient in humanity, lacking sufficient love and care and sorrow and compassion and support and acceptance and meaningful connections to other living beings... equate to the ever pure whiteness of power. the diagram so empty of illustration as the vastness of white space between concepts is preferred over the density of interdependent contexts.
existence is complex, and the snake oil salesmen chose to call it complicated and unnecessary, to erase the necessity of that which is incomprehensible... to sell a share in bullshit machines.
Marta Threadbare@cygnathreadbare @Gargron yeah, that's a garbage way this technology has been developed. Unfortunately if we threw away every technology built on the back of people doing bad things we wouldn't have much technology, unfortunately.
I don't fault lamenting how it's come to be and even how it's used broadly. But claiming it's useless because some folks use it poorly isn't really accurate indicator of the technologies usefulness.
Tim Mills@Tekchip @Gargron The technology doesn't yet do much of what is claimed for it; and it is already expensive in terms of externalized costs: memory, energy, water. It really looks like the future of LLMs depends on mass acceptance of the "what-if" scenario - those hoped-for advances where it works better, uses less energy, and somehow doesn't wipe out thousands of middle- to low-level jobs.