Mastodawn

Web developers: we are going to go out of our way to hide the scrollbars!

Users: but that makes it difficult to know how much of the text is left to read!

Web developers: don't worry, we'll add a non-standard UI element that signals this in some non-obvious, weird way!

@rysiek Spicy take: "Web developers" should not be a thing. You don't have any reason to "develop" for the web. The whole point was to factor things so that the browser and the server software were the only things that needed "development" and this development is reused by everyone. The actual documents you're publishing need writing/markup, not "development".

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Rotkäppchen Feb 20

@dalias @rysiek
Well, there are legitimate reasons to develop applications running in the browser engine (portability as the main one).
The problem is article sites pushing advertisement bullshit into everything, and you can‘t really do that if the user just enables Reader Mode. So, make your document tree useless for everything but proprietary CSS and JS.
A web dev should just be someone developing applications for the browser engines, like iOS devs for iPhone apps.

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LisPi

@libewa @dalias @rysiek Java and Common Lisp are two better examples of how to solve the portability problem.

(Portable bytecode and runs-from-source, respectively, for native programs. Of course Common Lisp (and Interlisp) also did bytecode before Java but nevermind that, bytecode is old.)