Warl0k3Well at least we know this wasn’t made by a lesbian since Scissoring isn’t real uuuugh
Dr. WeskerUh, what? It’s just a specific form of tribbing, is it not?
It’s “real” in that yes you can just rub your junk on stuff, including someone else’s junk - it’s not real in that it’s not, like, something people actually do, or that feels particularly stimulating for both partners just because of the geometry (it’s borderline impossible to get your bits to mutually line up). Basically as it’s commonly depicted, it’s not real. There’s stuff you can do with mutual thighs that can be quite nice if it works anatomically for you and your partner, but I’ve never seen that done in porn (and believe me I’ve looked)
iamthetotNot sure about this, seems like something a subset of people arbitrarily agreed applies to everyone. But I don’t have a vulva, so I can’t “for science” it.
There are financing options available…
The last thing I need are more holes, I can hardly take care of the ones I got.
Weird to “um acktually” gay sex.
… So, are you queer? Because in my experience bad representations of queer sex/relationships are a huge portion of the experience.
I am actually. I’m pan married to a trans person.
IDK what genitals you have so you may not be able to relate to the sexual aspect specifically as shown here, but do you never get tired of seeing the wild misrepresentation of what poly relationships are like in media?
Speaking just personally, I don’t really care myself how Poly is represented. My polyqueue is a happy little dynamic and that’s what matters. If media wants to say “haha look at us, we’re poly” and it’s just a bunch of group sex without the actual realization they are all individual relationships the same as mono ones, so be it.
Then again, poly in media is pretty under-represented. Lesbians in media are almost over-represented because of the ease of over sexualization of it. So I can totally understand your annoyance in the manufactured representation.
I suppose I came off a bit much in my first comment. I just know a couple lesbian friends who trib and they enjoy it.
It’s a square/rectangle thing, really. Tribbing is absolutely a thing, scissoring as a specific type of tribbing (as it is represented in porn) really isn’t.
I suppose I came off a bit much in my first comment.
I’ll be real, it’s pretty disheartening to get from a queer person the same kind of casual dismissal I get from (ex) my conservative-leaning relatives when correcting exhaustively common stereotypes about queer women. I’m sincerely glad you’re okay with the common stereotypes of you though.
(also totally unrelated, but it’s usually spelled polycule)
(also totally unrelated, but it’s usually spelled polycule)
Holy crap I didn’t realize how badly I butchered that. I forgot the L for god’s sake. How on Earth did I manage that?
Polyqueue is a deeply entertaining term for the more promiscuous ways to approach poly relationships which I’m absolutely using in the future so there’s that lmao.
Also, thank you. It’s unfortunate that your characterization of what I was doing seems to have colored the rest of the interactions in this thread, since correcting a common misconception really isn’t a “well ackchually” but… that’s just me whining into the void.
I dont know what all this means
Wtf is a queer spectrum?
What is “pan married”? As opposed to normal marriage?
What is a queer spectrum?
Just a term I’ve heard for different flavours of queer. Bi, Pan, Gay, Lesbian, Ace/Aro, etc.
What is “pan married”? As opposed to normal marriage?
So I am married to my partner. Before I met them (They’re trans/enby) they had a girlfriend for I think about 7 years? I married my partner. Since then I have two girlfriends myself and they’ve found a boyfriend on top of their girlfriend. So we both have two individual relationships outside of our marriage. And they’re full on mono-like relationships. I love my girlfriends; emotionally, romantically, and sexually. We have sex outside of my marriage and everything is all on the up-and-up with my married partner. My partner is less sexually charged as I am.
So basically, I am married and have two other full relationships and my partner has two other full relationships that aren’t me. And those relationships carry the same pros and cons as any relationship. I could be up late on the phone because something happened. One of my gf’s dad got diagnosed with cancer so I’ve done my best to be emotionally available for her when she needs it.
Pan isn’t just “Look at us and all the sex we have”. If you think one relationship is a lot of work, we both have three lol.
pride.com says it’s real
Scissoring is specifically genital on genital tribbing. Some people find varying degrees of success with scissoring vs. other forms of tribbing, but it’s definitely a thing (despite what many have come to think).
No, it’s not going to look like when you made your Barbies scissor (and we know you did) because humans have joints, and fat, and can get tired in strenuous positions. But with enough practice, communication, and trouble shooting, YES it is attainable for you to scissor if you really really want to.
The podcast they link to corroborates
“People are also spreading rumors that lesbians don’t scissor, which I don’t understand,” McCafferty said. “I’m like, that’s not true.”
“It’s literally all I do,” Myrick deadpanned.
The two commiserated over apparent frustrations that even lesbians are saying scissoring isn’t a thing.
“I’m like, ‘Then what are you doing?’” Myrick fired back, before turning the blame onto the wider availability of strap-ons in the midwest.
Wikipedia mentions the debate
Some lesbian and bisexual women do not engage in the scissoring position because they find or think it would be physically uncomfortable. They may also think it is a misconception that lesbians engage in the act and is therefore not representative of lesbian sexual practices, attributing it more so to the male fantasies of the heterosexual porn industry. By contrast, some sources, including Shere Hite’s 1976 and 1981 research, indicate that women may enjoy performing the scissoring position with other women because it is a variation of vulva-to-vulva contact or can allow for maximum such contact and therefore an elevated level of intimacy.
and that scissoring is a common umbrella term, which matches my recollection
Scissoring is commonly used as an umbrella term for all forms of tribadism, and many lesbian and bisexual women are unaware that some of the sexual acts they include in their lovemaking are aspects of and are formally labeled tribadism, as tribadism is commonly omitted from mainstream sex research.
It also mentions that tribade and related words had become archaic by the 20th century. ngrams confirms tribbing was obscure until it only recently took off in the last decade: I think pretty much everyone called it scissoring or rubbing before.
No, it’s not going to look like when you made your Barbies scissor (and we know you did) because humans have joints, and fat, and can get tired in strenuous positions.
I don’t know what pride.com is, nor have I heard of the podcast they’re linking to, however! nothing you’re saying here actually disagrees with what I’ve said elsewhere in this thread. Yes, tribbing is a thing. No, the common depiction of “scissoring” is not representative of tribbing on the whole. Wikipedia even makes the argument that the use of the term “scissoring” is because the term “tribadism” (tribbing) is no longer used and use the term “scissoring” to describe the same sex acts (something I very much disagree with, and isn’t exactly supported by how the term is used extensively in the remainder of that section)
tribadism is commonly omitted from mainstream sex research. Scholar Judith Halberstam stated, “If we trace the use of the term forward into present, we find that tribadism is one of those rarely discussed but often practiced sexual activities, and the silence that surrounds it now is as puzzling as the discourse it produced in earlier centuries.” Halberstam added that Sigmund Freud “had nothing to say” with regard to the topic, “and few contemporary lesbian sex books even discuss it”.
Google Ngram Viewer isn’t a good source, btw. It’s neat, but it’s bad quality data that doesn’t control for biases and it really shouldn’t be used to indicate social trends.
The data sets of the Ngram Viewer have been criticized for their reliance upon inaccurate optical character recognition (OCR) and for including large numbers of incorrectly dated and categorized texts. Because of these errors, and because they are uncontrolled for bias (such as the increasing amount of scientific literature, which causes other terms to appear to decline in popularity), care must be taken in using the corpora to study language or test theories. Furthermore, the data sets may not reflect general linguistic or cultural change and can only hint at such an effect because they do not involve any metadata like date published, author, length, or genre, to avoid any potential copyright infringements.
As an example, a random alternative explanation for the trend seen (assuming the data is accurate which we cannot do with ngram viewer) that I’ve just made up is that papers about the details of lesbian sex were unpopular, and the body of scientific and recreational literature is catching up with the terminology used in their subject matter as the topic becomes less anathema in grant applications. This would very much line up with the dates, and explain the growing usage of the more technical terms as the broadly accepted terminology catches up with the usage of the terms in literature.
Edit:
The podcast, at least in pride’s reporting, doesn’t seem to corroborate that it’s a real thing? Or at least it doesn’t concretely do so, as they explain the podcast’s interaction as:
The back-and-forth left viewers amused as they desperately tried to parse out whether the conversation was for real or just messing around, which actually proves quite thoroughly how confused society as a whole remains about the mythology of scissoring.
Which really doesn’t seem like they’re making the definite claim that it’s real, and I’m not sure why it’s being used as a source here in light of that ambiguity?
Seriously, what is pride.com? I’ve never heard of them before, are they a known entity?
You say that the common depictions of scissoring is not representative of tribbing as a whole. Which I completely agree with. Because tribbing is a word for “rubbing the vulva against something for stimulation”.
But that doesn’t mean that scissoring isn’t real. It’s a specific form of tribbing. And there obviously are people who have done and enjoyed that, and are now confused why people tell everyone that it isn’t real.
Sure, it may not look like the common porn depiction. But it may surprise you that the porn industry isn’t really good at representing actual sex in general. And just because you yourself don’t enjoy this position doesn’t mean others no not as well.
But that doesn’t mean that scissoring isn’t real. It’s a specific form of tribbing. And there obviously are people who have done and enjoyed that, and are now confused why people tell everyone that it isn’t real.
Sure, it may not look like the common porn depiction. But it may surprise you that the porn industry isn’t really good at representing actual sex in general. And just because you yourself don’t enjoy this position doesn’t mean others no not as well.
Sure, it may not look like the common porn depiction.
I thought the argument was the opposite, that it exists only in porn
I’m not 100% sure what the argument has become. Their source even lists the reason “scissoring” as it’s commonly shown in porn (the barbie thing) isn’t the real act. I think the issue is that I am using the term “scissoring” to refer to the barbie thing, as that is how the term is used among every lesbian I have interacted with as well as in all the writing about this topic from lesbians that I have engaged with, and their source is using the term “scissoring” as an umbrella term for “tribbing” (which they have clarified they’re doing).
I don’t think that we disagree on concept, just that they are arguing from a position of slight semantic difference. “Scissoring” the position seen in porn isn’t “real” tribbing. It’s a bit like the sex tips in cosmo - are there men that might enjoy having a doughnut eaten off their shaft, or who enjoy being jabbed in the balls with a fork while getting head? Yeah, probably, but I’m pretty sure we can agree that those specific examples shouldn’t be used as the common representation of what a “blowjob” consists of. Nor do I suspect anyone is going to argue that the insane and grotesque sex acts on urban dictionary are “real”, even if someone might have tried one of them once.
Anyone can do anything, and people are weird about sex - but as they’re intimated, the common depiction of the sex act in porn is a bad representation, and that is all I have been saying. If the argument truly is just that they think scissoring refers to all tribbing, their own sources show that’s a contested claim.
Yeah I think you’ve got it right that it largely has taken to mean in the community the most physically uncomfortable looking version of vulva-vulva tribbing, risk of kicking each other in the face and all. But that some people may be using it to refer to any vulva-vulva tribbing, possibly even mutual thigh tribbing, which can be comfortable, extremely erotic, and is very common. Or as you say, all tribbing. I’ve never thought of it as including such acts, but I see it for some of it. All it can take for a local community to start referring to it that way would be one slutty woman who calls it that and is really into it, then within a few years it’s all scissoring in Milwaukee
You claim anecdotally that a lesbian wouldn’t say they scissor. Pointing out that they do say it suffices. Your experience doesn’t encompass all lesbians of every generation, so we can refer to LGBT+ publications, direct anecdotes, history, & scholarly research. We have direct anecdotes from a podcast & affirming comments. The wikipedia article even calls out exactly what you’re doing & cites scholarly research. It explains with references that it is or was common for some tribadists not to recognize that word (or variants) & use scissoring more broadly to describe their activity.
Elsewhere, you add that a specific sense of scissoring (that the comic didn’t specify) of rubbing genitals together isn’t real. The cited references have some interesting quotes. In a Hite report
Sex with a woman for me has involved kissing, feeling one another completely, and basically humping – pressing mound of Venus against mound of Venus or each other’s leg.
Another cited reference explains tribade historically meant a woman taking the role of penetrator (with dildo or clitoris) before describing Anne Lister’s diary where she mentions genital to genital contact in her tribadism.
Most of their sexual activity seems to involve Anne touching Mrs. Barlow’s “queer” (as she calls the female genitals) and tribadically rubbing on her.
Anne manipulates Mrs. Barlow digitally but would prefer full-body tribadism, queer to queer, as she says elsewhere.
So, they do say they do that, too, even ages ago.
As for the ngram viewer, it’s not essential, however
- it’s true the corpora don’t reflect general language & culture, only that in a corpora including over 40 university libraries around the world
- similar trend as corpus without scientific literature indicates that’s not a source of bias
- we’re only reviewing recent texts with high quality OCR, so OCR issues don’t apply: OCR improved, not poorly printed archaic texts, tribbing doesn’t contain mistakable characters like long s
ſso OCR error should be uniform, not Chinese or a language difficult for OCR.
It indicates tribbing hasn’t historically appeared in print much.
While I appreciate the time you put into this, you haven’t really addressed my criticism - that podcast spends ~30 seconds on the topic, and even as explained in the article from whatever pride.com is, do not make a concrete statement beyond their own impressions. They even explicitly say that they feel like they are in the minority and that the prevailing attitude of lesbians is that we/they as a group don’t scissor. Also, there is a single comment on that page in support of their presentation of scissoring. That’s… not a plurality of support, nor is the podcast’s comment at odds with their own characterization of the culture surrounding the act presented in the podcast itself.
I’m not sure what your goal is with presenting the history of the term, but it is interesting to see the wikipedia article rewritten so succinctly, thank you!
Ngram viewer - it’s a representation of the data contained within it yes, as their initial paper says, but the way you’re using it here is at perfect odds with your own characterization of the service:
it’s true the corpora don’t reflect general language & culture
Which is what you’re claiming it does. If you’re shifting it to mean that tribbing hasn’t appeared in print much, I already agreed and my hypothetical addresses exactly this issue, as does the excerpt on the criticism of Google Ngram. Also wikipedia directly addresses this:
Scissoring is commonly used as an umbrella term for all forms of tribadism, and many lesbian and bisexual women are unaware that some of the sexual acts they include in their lovemaking are aspects of and are formally labeled tribadism, as tribadism is commonly omitted from mainstream sex research.
So there’s really not much to be said about it’s frequency of use in print media, just about the driving reasons behind it.
Ok this is actually making me want to try it as more than just a joke/to say I did.
Hey, it’s a common first form of tribidation before you realize it’s inconvenient and awkward as all hell. But also it’s definitely more commonly joked about than done
I hereby grant you the title of “Gaytekeeper”