Alex L 🕊 🇵🇸Oct 16
Markus 🤓✨

I've been interested in #datastar recently because of its server-driven, push-based nature, in comparison to all the pull-based stuff I end up doing in #HTMX.

For that reason, this background talk on Datastar was really interesting to watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0K71AyAF6E4

Real-time Hypermedia - Delaney Gillilan

YouTube
Oct 10 at 1:26pmWeb
Show threadChristiaan KrasOct 10
@markus yikes https://mastodon.social/@h4ckernews/115350295692371527
Show threadMarkus 🤓✨Oct 10
@Htbaa I think it’s fine that developers of nice tools charge money for their work. People can just choose to not buy it. Most of it is even still free! I don’t understand all the hate.
Show threadChristiaan KrasOct 10
@markus totally agree and I must confess I’m not familiar with Datastar. But saw that article and thought you might want to read it. I do think it’s a bit sketchy to move features from free to a paid license at one point.
Show threadEric MatthesOct 13

@Htbaa @markus I read that, and asked people who've been following the project for a bit. It sounds like a communication issue more than a rug pull.

My take so far is they identified a few features that weren't best practice, and if you use those features you'll probably need significant support. I believe that's what they're charging for.

I've also heard that HTMX is supporting push-based updates, which would make the distinction between the two projects less clear to me.

Show threadChristiaan KrasOct 13
@ehmatthes @markus Server Sent Events (https://htmx.org/extensions/sse/) are supported and there’s a system using HTTP headers which can be used to trigger events or redirect to another url etc.
</> htmx ~ The htmx Server Sent Event (SSE) Extension Extension

htmx gives you access to AJAX, CSS Transitions, WebSockets and Server Sent Events directly in HTML, using attributes, so you can build modern user interfaces with the simplicity and power of hypertext htmx is small (~14k min.gz’d), dependency-free, extendable, IE11 compatible & has reduced code base sizes by 67% when compared with react

Show threadEric MatthesOct 13

@Htbaa @markus Do you know the timeline around this? I'm curious if HTMX didn't support this direction, so Datastar was created. Or did HTMX support this, and the Datastar people had a different take on how to approach it?

I haven't used HTMX yet, but will before long, and I'm trying to understand both libraries before going deep into one of them.

Show threadChristiaan KrasOct 13
@ehmatthes @markus Good question, I think I've known htmx for about two plus years now and as far as I can tell these features have always been available.
Show threadAlex L 🕊 🇵🇸Oct 16

@Htbaa @ehmatthes @markus

IIRC HTMX original developer asked to a contributor to rewrite the SSE part and in the end he created Datastar

Show threadAlex L 🕊 🇵🇸Oct 16

@Htbaa @ehmatthes @markus

P.S. Datastar is not simply HTMX + SSE. It's HTMX + Alpine + SSE in just 10KB and allows you to use JavaScript in a declarative manner. It's more hypermedia-oriented than HTMX itself.

Show threadEric MatthesOct 16
@alxlg @Htbaa @markus Thanks for the clarification.
Show threadAlex L 🕊 🇵🇸Oct 16

@Htbaa @markus

It's not like that:

https://data-star.dev/essays/greedy_developer

Greedy Developer?

Datastar