BastelwombatJun 4
Julia Evans

was just reminded of how much I love the debugging manifesto poster that Inner Loop Press designed for Wizard Zines, you can get it for $20 US + shipping here: https://store.wizardzines.com/products/poster-debugging-manifesto

I'm SO delighted with how it turned out (also for more of Inner Loop's work, see https://www.innerloop.press/)

Jun 4 at 3:23pmWeb
Show threadferunandoJun 4

@b0rk loved it :)

i like to think of #4 and #6 kinda together as "the computer always does _exactly_ what you told it to do."

edit: and the zine seems lovely as well :)

Show threadDave AlvaradoJun 4
@b0rk I love mine. Rule 1!
Show threadJulia EvansJun 4
@dave aw I love seeing pictures of the posters in the wild!
Show threadHenning DetersJun 4
@b0rk 9 Take a break.
Show threadzaunkoenigJun 4
@DetersHenning @b0rk That is always important - when I did my PhD everyone closed their games or videos when the professor came in, but I kept it open saying that breaks are essential for productivity.
Show threadJonasJun 4
@b0rk
#TIL I discovered Inner Loop! If only they had a EU distributor
Show threadancilevien74Jun 4
@b0rk
#5 "don't *go* it alone", is it a typo ("go" instead of "do") or an expression I don't know as English is not my native language?
Show threadJulia EvansJun 4
@ancilevien74 yeah it’s an english expression!
Show threadEquity7804 🍉Jun 4
@b0rk @ancilevien74 Hi, do you mind explaining it a bit? Like does it mean the same thing as "do it" or maybe "go at it" in this context?
Show threadJulia EvansJun 4
@Equity7804 @ancilevien74 yeah "go it alone" basically means "do it alone" (but maybe with the extra implication that the thing is difficult or that doing it alone is a bit of a stubborn approach)
Show threadbabble encatJun 4

@b0rk It's all true, every word of it.

Also when I'm debugging I think of the medicine seller from Mononoke saying that he can't draw his sword until he knows the monster's Shape, Truth, and Reason.

Show threaddvdJun 4
It made me think of your talk at #amro22 @louis
Show threadLouis FrehringJun 10
@dvd It's nice to be remembered ! AMRO22 is so much good memories !
Show threadTobi OkanlawonJun 4
@b0rk this applies just as well to debugging systematic problems
Show threadJyrgen NJun 4
@b0rk @Diziet That is nice! I'd like to add too things:
* in very rare cases, it *can* be a hardware problem
* if you narrowed it down to a section of code that you can no longer understand, replace it
Show threadmodrobertJun 5

@jyrgenn @b0rk @Diziet > * in very rare cases, it *can* be a hardware problem

True, and that's when computers stop being logical.

Show threadGreg BellJun 4
@b0rk will forever be one of my favorite drawn expressions, so emotive
Show threadMegatronicThronBanksJun 5

@b0rk

And it's ok. All modern software is hideously overcomplicated and generally shit. Don't let this affect YOU!

Show threadkauerJun 5
@b0rk If you can find a copy of "Debugging C" (author escapes me at the moment), grab it. An absolute treasure trove, and mostly portable.
Show threadNelsonJun 9
@b0rk "computers are always logical, even when it doesn't feel that way" ... do you think that is still true in the LLM era?
Show threadJulia EvansJun 9

@skyfaller i mean I definitely wouldn't try to debug an LLM model in the way that this poster describes (or any machine learning model really, I've found you need a different skillset to debug machine learning models)

but certainly LLM-generated buggy code works the same way as any other buggy code

Show threadNelsonJun 9

@b0rk Fair, certainly code that doesn't directly run an LLM is still logical, more or less.

I was more thinking about how to a casual user it may not be clear what computer functions now use LLMs somehow and could return basically any result, and which still run entirely on logic. I had a fight with a friend over which Google results are LLM-generated, for example (I think I'm right but I'm not 100% sure), and this is increasingly baked into basic stuff on your computer, like Notepad.