Victor Buendía

Now everybody wants to put funds to attract talent from Harvard. On one side ofc is great. On the other side it kinda saddens me to see that suddenly there's additional UE funds for research... that have been never invested in places were they are urgently needed for years.

Most 'top students' in Spain, Greece or southern Italy cannot join a PhD in their country because of lack of funding and cutting-edge labs. A 'big PI' in Spain has usually 3-4 students, counting away some outliers in Madrid/Barcelona. A Prof position does never come with a 'starter pack', a lab, or students. These countries do usually well in math or theoretical physics because it's cheap. If you look at experimental facilities, we fall behind. Our unis have problems hiring new research personnel, have outdated labs, etc etc.

The US does a terrible policy and then suddenly everybody is considering what can we do to help them. And don't get me wrong, I believe it's a good thing to help people and a great opportunity to catch some exceptional scientists. Just saddens me to see top European talents absolutely wasted, for years, and there is little to 0 conversation about that in other places. As someone who has struggled a lot with this situation, it feels sad.

May 23 at 8:59amWeb
Show threadSune Auken6d ago

@vbuendiar

Hard agree!

Show threadTatjana Scheffler6d ago
@vbuendiar yup! Nevermind that ALL scientists and students under threat deserve our solidarity, not just a few bigshots that might be poached by European institutions.
Show threadVictor Buendía6d ago
@tschfflr absolutely!
Show threadBastian Greshake Tzovaras3d ago
@tschfflr @vbuendiar yep, it's pure profiteering while keeping to throw the existing scientists under the bus.
Show threadBashStKid6d ago
@vbuendiar @Ruth_Mottram You’re absolutely right. But hopefully this will be a wedge to increase other academic funding, and remove visa restrictions.
One can but hope …
Show threadAdam Steer6d ago
@vbuendiar ...its the same in Australia :/
Show threadJohn Carlos Baez6d ago

@vbuendiar wrote: "The US does a terrible policy and then suddenly everybody is considering what can we do to help them."

I doubt the EU is trying to help the US. I think they've realized they'll be able to hire top scientists for cheap.

For example:

"I start in Ireland at the beginning of June. Overall, I will be earning slightly less than here in the U.S. But the cost of living, aside from housing, is lower in Ireland. The salary reduction is worth it to me. I want to be able to engage in climate research without worrying each day whether or not my position is going to be terminated."

China will probably work harder to get US scientists, but many from the US will find the EU more comfortable, so the EU can pay less.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/world/usa-scientists-looking-to-leave-the-u-s-for-more-welcoming-environments-a-989ca73f-1dc9-4205-8405-1dc901c3623a

Exodus of Expertise: Scientists Looking to Leave the U.S. for More Welcoming Environments

The administration of U.S. President Donald Trump is making life difficult for academics and scientific researchers. Many are looking to leave the country as a result. We spoke with four of them.

DER SPIEGEL
Show threadVictor Buendía6d ago

@johncarlosbaez I 100% agree with you that some EU orgs see this as an opportunity for grabbing talent that maybe would not have considered coming otherwise.

Also salaries in the EU are lower than the US ones. As the message you cite there says, the cost of living is lower. For some top scientists, I am sure they will be able to negotiate good conditions in specific institutions which are above their EU peers. So I do not think that this is getting people 'for cheap': they are getting the best we can give, which I believe is fair.

Also I see many EU scientist that are willing to help: there is a lot of people of danger in losing their jobs in an absolutely unfair way and institutions here are moving to try to offer them a chance. I think that community spirit is very good from the scientific community :)

My main complain was a different topic, the fact that research funding is lacking in some areas of the UE that is rarely discussed. There's a lot of talent there that unfortunately has a lot of impediments to do cutting-edge research. And it seems that resources can be available if one really wants them, so for people coming from these countries it can feel discouraging at times.

Show threadJohn Carlos Baez6d ago
@vbuendiar - indeed, I know a lot of mathematicians and physicists from the EU, and many of them find it very hard to get jobs, especially the ones I know in Italy and Greece.
Show threadClickyMcTicker6d ago

@vbuendiar Vultures.
They’ve come to pick the carcass clean for their own benefit.

There’s no altruism here. Anybody who is making money appear out of nowhere is trying to buy Harvard students for dirt cheap. It’s a bankrupt business’s Everything Must Go Liquidation Sale, just for international students.

Show threadMyotis 5d ago

@vbuendiar As someone who wanted to move to EU for grad work, the other problem is EU visas are hard to get for students anyway - and there isn’t funding desire to spend on international students, *especially* from non EU countries. So while I agree it is sad that some EU countries are lacking updated facilities and labs, it is also a self issue because from my side as someone who wanted to go, sorry you are not better - you *also* don’t want anyone not already in your own country.

Thus, I think the better takeaway is this should be a wake up call to EU countries to get their shit together - you see what it is doing in the US so don’t follow that path. Invest in your universities, invest in science and research and open your doors; reap the rewards.

Show thread0xDE5d ago
@vbuendiar Think of it not as charity at the expense of locals, but as taking advantage of misfortune elsewhere to help your own local situation. Bringing in top talent from elsewhere should have a cascading effect that produces increased opportunity for local talent. That's how the US became a science powerhouse from the 1930s–1950s, by bringing in displaced scientists from Europe. Now it's someone else's turn to do the same thing.
Show threadAshley Reynolds3d ago
@vbuendiar omg this! Canadian institutions are in decline, and most PhDs I know have had to leave the country at least temporarily to stay in academia, but we want all the US scientists to come…