ByteOnBikesHumanity loophole: you can pay people less if they're from prison.
That’s why homelessness is being criminalized.
The explicit goal is to recreate Victorian workhouses for the benefit of the new generation of robber barons.
UnderpantsWeevilHey now, they won’t be called Workhouses. They’ll be called AI training data centers and Gig Opportunity Recruitment Points.
And if you don’t support these amazing engines of economic development and industrial growth, you are clearly just throwing your support behind the concentration camps that the Bad Team wants to build.
Hell, I how do I even know you’re not a Russian bot or a Chinese Wumao, trying to sow dissent in our glorious country, anyway?
FuckfuckmyfuckingassI’m sure Elon will give the camps some dip shit meme name.
The D Quuuuuillbachta tanks
“Marginal Demographic, Mandatory Assistance” camps?
Nah, he’ll make it some dumbass acronym.
Like “MDMA”, “WEED”, or “TUAH”?
Cyber-camps? Giga-gulags?
insomniac_lemonUnder most circumstances this seems like one of the less dystopian options*… because at least on the surface, this is a genuine everybody-problem and not something that drives profit.
Particularly if this actually gives them a career post-release, which seems to be the case in California for at least 4 years now. The alternative is dystopic again.
If this response is more pressured just because of where/who it effects, I could see that being an issue too. The context already dystopic though… like aside from the long-term heat and drought that will continue to be ignored, there was also the profit-over-safety of the PG&E hooks (from another article: PG&E knew old power line parts had ‘severe wear’ months before deadly Camp Fire).
*= Which is probably saying a lot, given that it involves an inferno. And yeah that pay is not great, but what they’re being charged daily is likely even worse.
CrackhappyParticularly if this actually gives them a career post-release, which seems to be the case in California
Federal Judge: Californians Who Fought Fires In Prison Can’t Become Career Firefighters
A California licensing law that bans many ex-offenders from working as full-time firefighters, even if they were trained to fight fires while imprisoned, was upheld last week by a federal judge.
Nearly all local fire departments require certification as an emergency medical technician (EMT). Yet under California law, EMT certification is off-limits to anyone who has ever been convicted of two or more felonies, has been released from prison for any felony in the past decade, or has been convicted of any two or more drug misdemeanors in the past five years.
DiplomjodlerThe system totally totally isn’t designed to keep the poor down.
I was going off of this:
RAMEY: We focus on the expungement process. So Gavin Newsom passed a law - I think about four years ago now - and what it pretty much does is help people that come out of, like, California Conservation Camps - being able to get their record expunged, which is amazing because it provides an opportunity where folks can, you know, apply to not only just fire careers, but, like, you know, they can have a brand-new life.
But you’re right, I guess expungement is not a guarantee but it is something.
And I did say
The alternative is dystopic again
expungement is not a guarantee
It’s only a guarantee if you’ve got lawyer friends or the money to hire a pro. But then how does that benefit unemployed felons?
It’s only a guarantee if you’ve got lawyer friends or the money to hire a pro. But then how does that benefit unemployed felons?
The guy I quoted is the co-founder of a non-profit.
1:
During pre-release, FFRP participants gain important information and resources needed for successful career planning. During post-release, FFRP participants receive critical job coaching, on-the-job training, paid work opportunities, and ongoing professional development. FFRP strives to ensure formerly incarcerated firefighters have the support needed to find long-term career success once released from state correctional Conservation Camps.
2:
In addition, the nonprofit works with other partners to help participants navigate the court system. In 2020, California passed a law that allows formerly incarcerated firefighters to petition the courts to expunge their convictions upon release. If they win approval, they don’t have to wait until their parole ends to apply for jobs within municipal and county fire departments or to pursue the EMT credentials required of most full-time, higher-paying firefighting positions.
With the help of the Legal Aid Foundation of Los Angeles, the fire recruitment program has successfully filed 38 petitions, 12 of which have been granted so far, and 21 of which are pending.
(from 2022)
Although my “not a guarantee” was with the context of a federal judge pushing back.
was upheld last week
The article is from Feb 2021, though. Maybe something changed?
My wife was a journalist in SoCal a while back. She did a story on some women prisoners that were used to assist in firefighting.
They worked alongside Cal Fire. It was rough work, they were right there in the shit.
She can’t recall if they were paid anything extra but she does remember that they ALL volunteered for it. They actually loved it.
TheReturnOfPEBIt should lead to them getting job offers if/when they get released.
It does not.
They are banned (or they used to be, looks like there were some legal changes recently) from being firefighters after they’re released, so…
Firefighting is known to attract arsonists… probably a bit harder to vet known criminals
Honestly if anything I think it would be easier than vetting someone with no background, you already have what they’ve been convicted of. Idk how many burglars or murderers like to dabble in arson.
If only there were more context and nuance available than “convict/not convict” when making such determinations and risk assessments about candidates…
Yeah but Lemmy said they are slaves.
I assume after being locked up long enough, people will agree to anything to go outside for a little while, and vary their routine.
In my job, I occasionally facilitate training for prisoner firefighters. Not only do they all love the job, they are also the best FD we train with. They read the material, study procedures, get it right when being observed. They get to stay at the firehouse instead of the prison itself, so both getting invited to do it and continuing to do it are huge for the inmates. They also love it. It burns my biscuit right up that they’ll not be able to be a firefighter when they get out.
They allow them to become firefighters nowadays.
The law changed recently
Depends on the state I imagine. But I just looked mine up and it’s “in the last 10 years” and not “ever” so that’s good.
UltraGiGaGiganticIn the end, we will all love big brother.
Yo, its the private fire fighters the guy was asking on Twitter about.
“I will pay any amount”
1 dollar per hour and your soul is pretty cheap.
Hey, they’re lucky not to be used as slaves!
The 13th Amendment states: “Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.”
I always assume it’s a European (or maybe Canadian) that makes posts like this. Last time I asked, I think they we’re European - definitely not American.
But I really hope that Americans, at least, know that the right to enslave is enshrined in their constitution.
American here, been saying it’s slavery for a while. Not all of us are clueless.
medgremlinOh, a bunch of us know, but because of gerrymandering and the ignorance of the larger populace, there’s not a goddamn thing we can do about it.
bdonvrPublic work is one thing if we had a fair justice system.
Private work is absolutely indefensible.
Grandmaster: Revolution? How did this happen?
Topaz: Don’t know. But the Arena’s mainframe for the Obedience Disks have been deactivated and the slaves have armed themselves.
Grandmaster: Ohhh! I don’t like that word!
Topaz: Mainframe?
Grandmaster: No. Why would I not like “mainframe?” No, the “S” word!
Topaz: Sorry, the “prisoners with jobs” have armed themselves.
Grandmaster: Okay, that’s better.
Definitely using this during my dnd session. The prison warden wardening prisoners with a job solely for their own benefit.
Thor Ragnarok is the only MCU movie I care to rewatch once in a while, along with Infinity War
I actually purchased Thor: Ragnarok so that I could watch it repeatedly. I love it so much. I’m pretty sure about 90% of that movie was ad-libbed by Taika just giving them a vague outline of what the scene is supposed to be about and then just setting the actors loose to improv to their heart’s content.
Edit: Also, watching Galadriel (Cate Blanchett) absolutely kill it as the most exasperated evil queen is one of my favorite things in a movie ever.
Da fuq? This is just plain wrong.
not legally. the constitution did not ban slavery completely. there is an explicit exception for prisoners.
I don’t think that they meant legally wrong, but rather morally wrong.
I know; that’s why I specified that this is legally allowed because it’s fucked up and it needs to be said.
cabillaudIt could be worse: they could be insured by UHC :)
They’ll probably need specialty pulmonology care later in life and a lot of public insurance plans either don’t cover it, or the waiting lists for Medicaid patients are obscene. At least UHC would get you onto the shorter waiting list.
So no more “Delay, Deny, Defend”?
Oh, they’ll absolutely still pull that shit, but there are a ton of medical practices that have a separate waiting list for Medicaid patients because they only accept a certain percentage of their patients being on Medicaid. UHC will still leave you with the bill, but having Medicaid can make it difficult to even see the specialist in the first place regardless of how much it will cost.
Dizzy Devil DuckyIf I was one of them, you bet I’d be doing everything in my power to get as many people to team up to run into the fire to avoid the indignity of modern slavery like that. Would rather burn to death.
You have clearly never burned to death then.
I have. I do not recommend it.
Well, I’m still alive, so I’ve obviously never burned to death.
Meh, jimmy down at the docks got burned to death twice last week, and Carol swears she was burned to life.
I ain’t rushing to make no assumptions.
Just figured “talking like that? That’s a person who ain’t never burned to death before I can tell you that.”
Na, I would be trying to the least amount of work possible.
Small easily contained/extinguished fire starts on a porch.
“I’m sorry man we can’t stop it. This is going to be a total loss.”
Slavery is alive and well in the United States Of America.
(As a side note it’s funny how, with a century of delay, the US pretty much followed the UK in making slavery “illegal” by just turning chattel slavery into indentured servitude. The non “funny” side is that Britain has already dropped indentured servitude but the US is busy actually expanding their variant of it with things like 3-strikes legislation)
The 13th Amendment to the US constitution makes slavery illegal except if the slaves are prisoners.
The 13th Amendment to the US constitution makes slavery illegal except for prisoners.
Exactly my point.
The typed of prisioners made to work like this in the US tend to be people who are in prison for crimes related to poverty, not things like murder, making it it a lot like indentured servitude worked in Britain were people who couldn’t pay their debts were used as slaves.
ThatKomputerKatI think one of the absolute stupidest things about this when it comes up is that when these same people get let out of prison they can’t even get the job of fire fighter because of their criminal record.
RememberTheApollo_While no legal system is perfect, I much prefer the way some countries prevent the public from hearing the actual names of criminals or someone’s criminal history. Not everyone needs to be branded for life with a scarlet letter. It would reduce recidivism as well.
They’re slaves, not incarcerated firefighters.