eccentricJustice should be equal
The Yungest OnionBecause it’s about sending a message. They’ve seen how popular this guy and his actions have become and are trying to throw everything at him so it puts off any copycats.
rickdgTrue, hopefully it will backfire.
KecessaDeath penalty increases violence because murdering the person catching you becomes a way to increase your likelihood of surviving.
Death penalty backfires because it demonstrates fear for what this person keeps saying.
That would make him a martyr. I’m thinking the plan is to lock him up in max for life, then control the media narrative whenever his name comes up again.
So basically, killing Luigi would not make copycats less likely, but it WOULD make it more likely for copycats to shoot CEOs AND cops?
Hmm… The killing of Luigi itself would be awful, of course, but the consequences of it sound like a win to me 🤔
AFaithfulNihilist[oh no… Anyway. PNG]
No, the death penalty increasing violence is about incentives.
If I shoot someone dead and you are the only witness, I have a choice to make. If I do not want to be executed, killing you is the best chance for escaping punishment.
The more severe the punishment the more desperate one will become to avoid it.
Haven’t seen any copycats yet.
itslilithPlans take time. Better wait a few weeks until the CEOs start to relax again
The death penalty has not been executed in NY/federal court for decades right? Doesn’t seem like an actual threat. What they want to achieve is a good negotiating position for a plea bargain because they known a trial will be a shitshow.
Except all they have done is make him a martyr, and now anyone who wants to be infamous is more likely to do something.
Random_Character_AAn interesting factoid. In Finnish language “väkivalta” means violence. It is a combination word:
väki = people, crowd, folk
valta = power, reign
dogsoahCSo… in Finland “democracy” and “violence” are the same thing? xD
IsoKieroVäki also means (or at least used to) ‘power’ or ‘strong’ (väkivahva, väkijuoma…) and that’s also where the etymology for ‘väkivalta’ comes from. So it’s got nothing to do with people.
Valta also sounds like a Germanic loan just a second… yep. Same root as German “Gewalt”, violence, “walten”, to rule, preside, “verwalten”, to administer, also English wield.
What’s it with Finnish. One third borrowed from Estonian, another third from the Swedes, the rest from the Sami.
Yes. We are a mushroom people that suddenly popped in to existence and had to borrow some stuff.
This is true.
MILDLY infuriating??!?
The [email protected] community seemed dead so I posted it here instead.
To put it mildly. 😋
Shouldn’t there be leniency for killing a killer?
Yes I know it’s about “sending a message”, but messages go both ways.
Yes I know it’s about “sending a message”, but messages go both ways.
In this case, I wouldn’t even call Luigi a killer. He’s a hero, if any.
When the killing is in self defense or in the defense of many, many victims, is this called justifiable homicide?
Because most school shooters aren’t adults.
Yeah, because the US “justice” system famously never treats juvenile defendants as adults in order to mete out draconian punishment that eliminates all chances for rehabilitation…
And they have definitely ratified the UNCRC because they definitely do not want to put kids in adult prisons, right?
The US Supreme Court prevented people who committed crimes as juveniles from being executed a number of years ago. Trump’s group might change that, but for now it is the law. They technically cannot be incarcerated forever either.
I mean Luigi barely counts.
Isn’t he 26?
Exactly, so he’s just now turning into his final adult sets of ideas and personality.
In the US an 18 year old is the same as a 26 or 56 year old under the law.
ChozoAlso, most school shooters don't survive.
apnews.com/…/unitedhealthcare-ceo-killing-luigi-m…
That doesn’t mean they can’t be tried as terrorists. The main problem here is actually whether or not the facts of the crime actually allow for a terrorism charge. Fact is, he had a manifesto (see ideological goals), and the shooting was a violent criminal act.
According to the FBI that’s all it takes. It may also be what is lacking in the case of some school shooters.
While I am generally on the side of “CEO FAFO”, I recognize that the problem here is that the FBI and the laws they follow are flawed (probably deliberately) in such a way that they only target those who target the wealthy.
Shooting up a school is an act of terrorism if you do it because you’re targeting a soft target in an attempt to hurt the local, state or federal government or you’re religiously motivated etc. But not if you were bullied.
There’s been plenty of over 18 mass shooters who also haven’t been charged with terrorism. And with each one there’s people who will say they don’t want the US to become more of a police state because they believe that counterterrorism techniques (which we use internationally) shouldn’t be used against the general population.
The federal government has a habit of overstepping the rights and freedoms of the general public any time they feel like they are under attack. We saw this with 9/11 and the Patriot act. So I can see their reasoning even if I don’t agree that mass shooters should be considered terrorists under the law.
How New York prosecutors used a terrorism law in the charges against Luigi Mangione
New York prosecutors are using a 9/11-era anti-terrorism law in their case against the man charged with killing UnitedHealthcare’s CEO. Luigi Mangione was indicted this week on charges of murder as an act of terrorism. He was charged under a state law that allows for stiffer sentences when a killing is aimed at terrifying civilians or influencing government. Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg says the shooting was intended to sow terror. Bragg notes that the gunfire erupted early on a work day in a heavily trafficked business and tourist area. He also mentioned Mangione’s writings. Mangione is jailed on other charges in Pennsylvania. He hasn’t yet answered the Manhattan ones. His New York attorney called the case “overcharged.”
They really gonna try to turn this guy into a martyr?
Looks like it.
Then we need to make him a saint.
St. Luigi of Baltimore, forgive us our debts, deliver us from the greed of the wicked…
And shepherds we shall be.
For Thee, my Lord, for Thee.
Power hath descended forth from Thy hand.
That our feet may swiftly carry out Thy command.
So we shall flow a river forth to Thee.
And teeming with souls shall it ever be.
In Nomine Patris, et Fili, et Spiritus Sancti."
Bakkoda
DontTreadOnBigfoot
GladiusBThat.doesnt work out historically for them.
They spent last 25 years deploying infrastructure for oppression because peasants have nothing to hide.
I bet owner class is looking to test how good it is.
The media blitz early is a fail but they got a lot of other tools.
Did you see the drones bros!?
Omg bro UFOs omg dont pay attention to dead CEO bro, trust me bro.
Actually I missed the drone stuff. I was working a lot.
I kind of think they don’t know what to do about this.
It doesn’t seem smart for them to make him a martyr. Doesn’t seem smart to Epstein him.
I’ve been thinking for a few years now that, since no one with power ever seems to know what they’re doing, there’s something about power itself that makes the person who holds it selfish and incompetent.
They failed above their own Peter Principle limit.
hungryphrogAdding “Mangione gets a shrine” to my 2025 bingo
Who are “they”?
Read the picture’s caption and tell me if any of the nouns used can be context for “they”, please.
And now that Republicans are set to have the Presidency, Congress and SCOTUS all at the same time, there doesn’t seem to be any barriers left.
Abolish capital punishment!
marighostNew York doesn’t have the death penalty though?
He’s askari getting federal charges. Those do.
The feds also indicted him. There’s zero chance a Trump AG isn’t going to be pushing for the death penalty. What they cannot seem to understand is that this will only make him a martyr. They should have just given him the standard NY Murder II conviction any other killer would get, but they just couldn’t help themselves. They had to really send a message to the proles.
All they will succeed in doing is elevating him to outright sainthood.
The state of New York is about to get a firsthand lesson in the Streisand Effect. They should have just charged him the same charge any normal killer would get - Second Degree Murder, which is the normal charge for premeditated murder in NY. First degree requires rare special circumstances, and the prosecutor chose to use a dubious “terrorism” modifier to up the charge to Murder 1. They just couldn’t help themselves, and they shot themselves in the foot.
The advantage to the prosecution to a simple Murder 2 charge is that motive really doesn’t matter much. They just have to prove that Luigi pulled the trigger. But with the terrorism modifier, the trial will no devolve into lengthy discussions about his motives and message. Not only have they now given him the world’s largest soapbox, but this will also give the defense an opportunity to make him much more sympathetic to the jury. With only a Murder 2 charge, the defense lawyer would have had to fight hard to sneak subtle hints into trial about Luigi’s motives. Now his motives will be a core part of the prosecution’s case.
With a simple Murder 2 trial, even jurors who thought Thompson got what he deserved could vote to convict based simply on the letter of the law. Luigi killed an evil man, but he still has to face the consequences like any other criminal. Now the jury will clearly see that the system isn’t treating him like any other criminal. The prosecutors, through their own actions, are making Luigi’s case for him - the justice system is completely rigged in favor of the rich and powerful, and the only way they can ever be held accountable is through violence.
All it takes is one juror of twelve to look around at the situation and say, “this is bullshit. I’m not going to convict.” Sure, they can try him again with a new jury if he’s not found unanimously not-guilty, but that jury will have an even greater risk of jury nullification. The longer this goes on, the more likely the prosecutor just has to offer him some sweetheart plea deal just to get him convicted of something. And each trial just elevates Mangione that much closer to literal Sainthood in the popular imagination.
Except in every step things can develop the ways you haven’t thought about.
And courtroom shows are kinda common enough in movies and even in reality. People will have strong feelings, but this doesn’t seem a major thing for many.
So - too much copium. I hope you are right and I am wrong, of course.
Yeah, first degree requires a deep look into the motives, which is really good for him.
Here’s some legal analysis by legal eagle youtu.be/vXkH-G_8xew
Luigi the Terrorist? Federal Prosecution?
IronKrillI, too, watched Legal Eagle’s video.
New York doesn’t even have the death penalty, feds would have to pursue that avenue.
It’s been mentioned before but NYC will be using special jury screening processes to make sure none of the jurors are “terrorist” sympathizers.
Maybe they should charge his parents too, like they did with some other school shooters. But wait, his parents are rich and the other ones lived in trailer parks.