superkretSysadmin shock as Windows Server 2025 installs itself
GreeNRGSince rolling back to the previous configuration will present a challenge, affected users will be faced with finding out just how effective their backup strategy is or paying for the required license and dealing with all the changes that come with Windows Server 2025.
Hmmm accidentally force your customers to have to spend money to upgrade, how convenient.
DremorCongratulation, you are being upgraded. Please do not resist. And pay while we are at it.
HupfI have a message and a question.
A message from ESR and a question from me.
We are the Borg.
MaestroSince MS forced the upgrade, you should get 2025 for free. That would probably be really easy to argue in court
Ah, but did you read the article?
MS didn’t force it, Heimdal auto-updated it for their customers based on the assumption that Microsoft would label the update properly instead of it being labeled as a regular security patch. Microsoft however made a mistake (on purpose or not? Who knows…) in labeling it.
MaggiWuerzeThen it’s still on Microsoft for pushing that update through what is essentially a patch pipeline
It is, but they never forced anyone to take the update, so that might save their asses, or it might not
M$'s mistake creates no obligation to pay, either way. They cannot sue anyone for the money.
But some customers (depending on their legislation) might sue M$ to make broken systems running again, for example if these systems have stopped now with a ‘missing license’ error message.
This would be no different to you ordering food in a restaurant, them bringing you the wrong meal, you refusing because you didn’t order it, then they tell you to go fuck yourself and charge you for it anyway.
If this argument is valid in your judicial system then you live in a clown world capitalist dictatorship.
I’m saying they might send people the bill and then these people (well, companies) are going to have to fight it in court, where they’ll be right for sure, but Microsoft can make a lot of stupid arguments to prolong the whole thing, to the point where it’s cheaper to pay the license fee. For one they could say that continued use of the operating system constitutes agreement to licenses and pricing.
Either way this is server 2025 not windows 12. We’re talking about companies here, not people.
Yes, and I’m saying that the fact this could even be viewed by Microsoft as something that is worth going to trial, and being argued in court = hyper-capitalist dystopian dictatorship.
Have you seen the state of the US? A "clown world capitalist dictatorship" is a pretty apt description
Why yea … I am aware 1+1=2
MS will be sued over this and they will lose. This is not an ambiguous case. They fucked up. It’s essentially an unconsentual/unilateral alteration to a contract, which kinda violates the principle of, you know, a contract.
Uh, if they didn’t ask for it, how is Microsoft going to make them pay for it?
Good luck arguing with Ms if you aren’t a giant company
KokeshIt must have been the same fun as when back in 2012 (or 2013?) McAfee (at least I think it was them) identified /system32 as a threat and deleted it :)
funkajunkOne of the few things that accursed software actually got right!
DrDystopiaHaha, that’s great!
Crowdstrike moment
dan1101Of all the people MS doesn’t want to piss off.
Misleading title. It was installed by a third-party updater, Heimdall, but MS labeled a Windows 11 update wrong.
They labelled an OS version upgrade as a security update.
ddittyYet another reason to not do auto-updates in an enterprise environment for mission-critical services.
In an enterprise environment, you rely on a service that tracks CVEs, analyzes which ones apply to your environment, and prioritizes security critical updates.
The issue here is that one of these services installed a release upgrade because Microsoft mislabelled it as security update.
The issue here is that one of these services installed a release upgrade because Microsoft mislabelled it as security update.
Should still be doing phased rollouts of any patches, and where possible, implementing them on pre-prod first.
Pre-prod is ideal, but a pipe dream for many. Lots of folks barely get prod.
We still stagger patching so things like this only wipe some of the critical infrastructure, but that still causes needless issues.
SomeGuy69For security updates in critical infrastructure, no. You want that right away, in best case instant. You can’t risk a zero day being used to kill people.
AppoxoEven security updates can be uncritical or supercritical. Conault the patch notes or get burned lol
Wrong.
Microsoft labelled the update as a security update
Do you know that’s nor a mistake and done fully malicously knowing that? Please give me your source.
Read the fucking article.
And you make absolutely no error?
Besides tbat:
Should MS have caught the errorenous ID (assuming it truly was errourneous and not knowingly falsely labeled)? Absolutely.
Should the patch management team blindly release all updates that MS releases? No?
It’s amazing how many people don’t understand psych management at scale and are blaming MS for this. On the lemmy communities I assume this is intentional.
Do system administrators still exist? Honest question. I was one of those years ago and layoffs, forced back to office bullshit drove me away
Idk dude, I got a redundancy about a year ago. There are still jobs out there but it feels like it’s dwindling.
What do you do now?
What, do you think it’s all run by AI now?
No, just not many job postings for it. Go look on indeed with that exact title. Switch to remote, almost no jobs
So yes, they still exist.
yes, but we spend most of our time in meetings with cloud service vendors now.
I haven’t been inside the server room for a month.
I haven’t been inside the server room for a month.
ToriborI only go in the server room to t-pose in front of the giant air conditioner to cool off.
I’m not necessarily talking about being in the server room, I’m talking about more like doing power shell stuff and the stuff you would think system administrators do. They are still teaching active directory in IT classes in college
Yes, this is still a crucial job role for most organizations.
There are dozens of us (working for MSPs because in house doesn’t pay as well and companies are cheap and want to outsource that cost center)!
I switched from an MSP to a unionized in-house position, doubled my salary and my days of paid time off.
Nice! I’ve job hopped a few times and tripped my salary in 5 years and am at a unicorn msp with unlimited PTO and management that cares about employees.
I wish I could find a union IT shop, but nothing around that I’ve seen aba8.
“Unlimited PTO” is a meaningless term, and a trap.
See, I have 42 days of PTO per year, plus 13 state holidays.
I have a right to take those days off, they can’t be denied by anyone.
And if I don’t take them, my team lead will have a talk with me in October at the latest, because the company would get in legal trouble if I didn’t get them.
With “unlimited PTO” you have no such right to any amount of PTO.
Sure, you could try to schedule lots of PTO, but it can just be denied (“not possible right now”), or if you take too many, you’re just fired.
Plus they don’t have to book the liability on the balance sheet!
Lettuce eat lettuceI worked for a classic MSP a while back, barely lasted 3 months. Such a toxic environment, tons of pressure to spread yourself thinner and thinner.
It was one of those places where you were expected to be there an hour early, stay an hour late, and work through your lunch.
Even though that’s illegal, it was never explicit, just one of those, wink wink type things. But the workload was always so heavy, you couldn’t stay on top of everything unless you were working 50+ hours a week.
And of course, all salary, no overtime or double time for weekend work.
I do internal IT now, much better. Trying to get my own one-person shop going to eventually be fully self-employed. Actually, it would be really cool to become a worker-owned co-op, but that’s still a faint dream.
Currently in an MSP. It’s all on the company culture as to if it’s shit or not. We’re fully wfh with no plans to move back to the office.
Overtime is never forced. If we have to work through lunch because all hell is breaking loose, we’re practically encouraged to leave an hour early unless the CEO is allowing ot and we want it. No pressure either direction.
If users are rude or generally hard to deal with, manager has our back in dealing with them.
Pay isn’t top dollar but there’s trade-offs
€ or good team, right?
I just accepted a job with a small MSP starting early next year. I kept a close ear out during the interview for signs of the classic MSP hell stuff that would chew through techs but it does look like I got a good one (small 8 or so man shop) but check in in about 3 months and we’ll see how I’m feeling haha
You’ll let us know if they’re hiring, right? Right!?
That’s my job title.
vorsprung@Dashi @Buttflapper I was "site reliability engineer" for a while or sometimes "cloud administrator" and now "platform engineer"
It's the same stuff I've been doing since 1988
Yeah I always automated everything.
It's the same stuff I've been doing since 1988
Yeah I always automated everything.
I think they call them devops now.
I still prefer sysop.