Jan Wildeboer 😷Oct 3, 2024

(Thread) In the olden days, a FOSS (Free/Open Source Software) project typically had:

- A source code repository
- A web page with the documentation, FAQ and links to downloads
- At least one mailing list called announce, typically also one for users and one for contributors, all with public archives
- (maybe) An IRC channel to chat with other users and maybe also the developers

Maybe it’s time to try that simple approach again? Everything open, everything accessible? 1/7

Show threadJan Wildeboer 😷Oct 3, 2024
In those olden days, we also had some helpful rules. One was that only things that can be referenced in code or mail archives actually exist. So when there was a long discussion on IRC, someone wrote down the outcome (or coded the patch) and made it accessible to all. This was an important rule to avoid excluding those that didn’t have the time/willingness/connectivity to spend hours on IRC. 2/7
Show threadJan Wildeboer 😷Oct 3, 2024
When I now see slack, discord, github etc everywhere as a *requirement* for participation, I think that we are exchanging a bit of comfort for the IMHO very high price of excluding a lot of potential contributors and giving a lot of data to proprietary companies without a real need for that. 3/7
Show threadJan Wildeboer 😷Oct 3, 2024
Maybe this short thread makes you think a little bit about that. That would mean a lot to me! Run your projects in every way you want, I am not telling you to make changes. I merely hope that you start to think a bit about what's best to grow your community in an inclusive and open way, is all :) 4/7
Show threadJan Wildeboer 😷Oct 3, 2024
I am throwing this out here not to come over as a grumpy old man, yelling at the clouds. But because I guess many enthusiastic, young people simply never experienced the olden ways. Maybe they want to explore them a bit and see for themselves if there could be something viable in it for them. Especially wrt async communication. Is all! 5/7
Show threadQOct 3, 2024

@jwildeboer I've been contributing/following a few big projects that only use mailing list based contributions (Yocto, U-Boot bootloader, Linux kernel, libcamera, Buildroot). The last few years we've seen a lot of people voicing their discontent at that workflow and requesting we do everything with GitHub/GitLab "or else you will never get a contribution from me".

So I am not sure those young people are that interested in that old workflow.

Show threadKevin Granade has moved

@0leil @jwildeboer after running a largeish project for a decade now I am immediately skeptical of anyone saying, "you won't get contributions from me unless you change something".

In practice this has always landed somewhere between "when pigs fly" and "don't threaten me with a good time".

Oct 3, 2024 at 4:02pmWeb
Show threadQOct 3, 2024
@kevingranade @jwildeboer The issue is that most FOSS projects are underfunded, understaffed, overworked or its devs/maintainers on the brink of burn out or - most likely - all at the same time. Having more contributors and especially retaining them is crucial, so it's not always easy to say "please, more contributors" and then shun people away with "yes but not by changing our contributor workflow". If we keep hearing from different people we lost potential contributions because the contribution workflow was unacceptable to them, we have to decide whether the loss of their theoretical contribution was worth it. I don't have the answer.