WilshireMove over, Ford and Chevy: Kei trucks are pulling up as customers opt for smaller, cheaper vehicles
9point6I’m sorry, why the fuck aren’t these street legal in more than half of the states? The article says something about safety, but these are street legal all over Europe where we have stronger safety regulations.
Also there’s something I can’t put my finger on about the journalist choosing a hero image of the van losing its cargo.
Probably because it’s not safe to drive them around giant pickups who can’t see over their hoods
Ya. Everything’s expensive, so people buy the cheapest thing [with four wheels]. I don’t want folks on the lower end of the socioeconomic spectrum to think these are a safe option.
If(?) a ‘90s Honda sedan is safer but the Kei is new and looks cute, for the same price many will choose the less safe option.
Eight Californians die on our roads every day here and I can’t wait for some solutions. I really do empathize with everyone you readers care about (no oil companies, no just-for-funsies-truck manufacturers) - I hate the thought of crumpled and crushed human bodies.
What makes you think it's not safe?
Just added something about that - articles & crash tests over the years. Was interested in little vehicles myself. Intrigued seeing them on college campuses.
neuracnuThin steel frame, no air bags, no crumple zones.
Check out the crash tests: www.youtube.com/watch?v=roLcNwRi1Sk&t=40s
Low-speed vehicle crash tests
BuelldozerWow, the Kei truck does not fare well at all in that offset test!
How’s that different from driving a car roughly the same size?
Just noting as a reference these trucks are 11ft long, a Miata is roughly 20% longer at 13ft.
Just for reference a Fiat 500 is roughly 9.75 feet long.
Maybe in the 70s, a modern 500 is listed at 11.6 ft
It looks like I got my info mixed up, thank you for the correction.
Doing comparisons like these don’t make sense when motorcycles and trikes exist.
I didn’t intend for it to be a comparison, I just find many people hear “small truck” and imagine “like a ford ranger but smaller”, as their starting reference point. Gotta go smaller, scale is tough.
My bad. It just seems like the low hanging fruit everyone plays off of.
We actually used to get vehicles close to this size. The Suzuki samurai (really a jimny) was sold here for a number of years. Geo sold a fair number of almost kei cars that Suzuki made.
I’m a fan of limiting them from interstate highways, but keeping them registrable. It’s just dumb they cite “safety” even though the law explicitly calls out they aren’t required to be safe. I just want a nice 25-45 mph city truck to lug dirty junk around.
But if anyone is curious, Douglas deBoard imported so many European cars in the 80’s that cut into the profits of Mercedes USA enough that they pushed the law through. Buying them in Europe and importing them was actually cheaper (in some aspects) than buying a US market one. And the imported cars were better equipped!
It wasn’t even about protecting American manufacturers or trucks. Mercedes has just always been a huge dick.
No lie. Gray market Mercedes were awesome. Way more powerful and you could get base models with zero cruft - manual transmissions and wind up windows.
Europe and Japan all have freight trucks, so I don’t buy that. The fact that many states won’t allow these is American truck manufacturing protectionism, nothing more. It’s the same reason you can only get a 3/4 or 1 ton truck from Ford, Chevy, or Ram (chicken tax).
It’s all about the chicken tax.
Cab over engine freight trucks with excellent visibility, not jacked up chevys where your view of the ground starts 20 feet in front of you
And that’s precisely because the option isn’t readily available here. We can argue merits of different countries versus the US, but at the end of the day it is what it is unless something changes at the legislative level.
When say a contractor goes to purchase a work vehicle, the option is either a van, which have pathetic motors and hauling capabilities, or a pickup from one of the big 3 that can be outfitted with a utility body. Sometimes you can score one of those Isuzu cabovers, but they’re far and few between, and often more expensive. Vans are also stupid expensive, especially 4x4 models, because of the van life crowd. The options really are much more limited than other parts of the world, and I truly believe it’s to keep prices high and the money vacuum humming.
I ended up buying a Ram 2500 when looking for a work truck. I would’ve loved a 25/35 class van, but I need 4x4 (mountains, snow), and because of the premium those models fetch due to demand from the van life people, that wasn’t an option.
And I dunno about other people, but I know what’s in front of my truck at all times. It really isn’t that hard to mind your surroundings.
The front view from a freight truck is better than that of a f150.
Sure, but as I responded to someone else, show me a viable option that’s readily available in the states for a contractor or someone delivering heavy stuff that has the power and 4x4 to do the thing at a reasonable price. I’m all for getting some of these European/Japanese solutions over here, but they simply aren’t available or affordable, and so we’re stuck with oversized pickups and under powered vans until something changes.
Ban anything bigger than a Kei?
IIHS condemns use of mini trucks and low-speed vehicles on public roads - Autoblog
If you live in the U.S. sunbelt or in an upscale gated community, you've probably seen quite a few of those hopped-up electric golf carts trolling around your neighborhood. These low-speed vehicles are great for zipping to the mailbox or heading over to the clubhouse, and the vehicles are currently allowed on select public roads in 46 of the 50 United States. But even though they're perfectly legal in many areas, The Insurance Institute for Highway Safety has a pretty serious warning for anyone
I’m sorry, their problem is that the massive trucks are somehow in danger because they weren’t designed to handle being hit by a vehicle less than half its size?
What a ridiculous statement.
That’s not what they are saying at all. They’re saying small vehicles aren’t even safe in crashes with other small vehicles, let alone with bigger vehicles.
They took a street legal Smart ForTwo…
Then crashed it into a Kei and a little electric truck…
And they want stuff to be as safe as the Smart car.
blazeraThis is how we got in this mess, an arms race of trying to feel safe around larger and larger hunks of metal on the road. Americans just have to endanger everyone else for their own peace of mind.
And yet Smart cars are legal.
Smart cars had to pass US crash test standards and have the appropriate safety equipment. The kei trucks that you can currently import and use are 25+ years old and wouldn’t have even passed US standards back then. Your legs are the crumple zone in these things.
I assume that new ones would have a chance, but it’d be expensive for a manufacturer to modify and certify for the US market. Small cars haven’t sold well here, and the profit margins are slim.
Maybe with the recent size and price increases in autos here, well see some movement. I’d love a modern Honda kei to go with my element.
I get all that, but the individual I replied to only related small size to safety. I was merely pointing out that size isn’t a factor.
I appreciate your post, and agree completely! A Kei truck would satisfy all my requirements for a utility vehicle.
The crumple zone thing is a bit grey as the USA sells and allows trucks like the Isuzu NPR/Chevy Cab Over.
But then it’s these giant pickups which are unfit and should not be road legal.
Protectionism.
European road safety regulations are significantly weaker than those in the US and Canada.
Pretty sure that’s not the case, had a little Google and it seems like I’m right, but I’m open to being corrected if I’m wrong or misunderstanding what you mean. Here’s evidence to support my claim:
etrr.springeropen.com/…/s12544-014-0131-7
Why is road safety in the U.S. not on par with Sweden, the U.K., and the Netherlands? Lessons to be learned - European Transport Research Review
Purpose This study compared road safety and related factors in the U.S. with those in Sweden, the United Kingdom, and the Netherlands (which are among the best-performing countries), in order to identify actions most likely to produce casualty reductions in the U.S. Method The reviewed topics were basic country statistics, road fatalities and various fatality rates, and selected road-safety issues. Results The main differences concerned structural and cultural factors (such as vehicle distance driven), and procedural factors (such as alcohol-impaired driving, exceeding speed limits, and use of seat belts). Conclusions The main recommendations for improving road safety in the U.S. are as follows: (1) lower states’ BAC limits, and encourage the use of alcohol ignition interlocks (2) reexamine the current speed-limit policies and improve speed enforcement, (3) implement primary seat-belt-wearing laws in each state that would cover both front and rear occupants, and reward vehicle manufacturers for installation of advanced seat-belt reminders, and (4) reconsider road-safety target setting so that the focus is on reducing fatalities and not on reducing fatality rate per distance driven, and (5) consider new strategies to reduce vehicle distance driven.
You’ve never been to Europe, lol.
I’ve lived in several European countries and also worked in compliance departments for auto manufacturers. You have zero clue what you’re talking about.
Yet you back up your claim with nothingness. Not quite sure how living in a country makes you an expert on regulations. Why didn’t you add substance? The compliance department in the companies I worked for wouldn’t be experts btw.
Speed restrictions.
Kei trucks were designed for use in dense Japanese cities, which is why they also work in European cities. They are nimble but have a low top speed. You’re not going 70 mph around a street corner for instance.
It would work in places like NYC for the same reasons, but remember that most of the USA is suburban or rural. You need vehicles that are capable of going fast if you’re going to get on a highway.
A possible workaround is to have a separate class for these, like mopeds or scooters, which are road legal but are not highway legal.
In Illinois, at least, your motorcycle has to be 150cc to ride on the interstate. A Chinese GY6 scooter might be able to do 50MPH with a tailwind. You'd get killed on the interstate on one of those, yet, fully legal to do it.
You’d get killed on the interstate on one of those,
You guys in Illinois are crazy though. I learned very quickly how much that 55 MPH limit is a guideline and not a hard limit.
A long, long time ago, I used to drive from Kenosha, WI, to Wilmette (and later Northfield), IL, for work, down I-94, in a 1986 Honda CRX. Up until about Tower Rd., I was doing 105MPH every day, and people were passing me like nothing.
I was doing 105MPH every day, and people were passing me like nothing.
No they weren’t. Late 80s / early 90s cars didn’t GO that fast. Your CRX had a hypothetical top speed of 111MPH and in the real world probably couldn’t even reach the 105 you are claiming.
By comparison the 1990 Camaro Iroc Z topped out at 152MPH and the Mustang GT topped out at 140. The Corvette ZR-1 could reach 175 but those were vanishingly rare. 1990 Porsche 911 top speed was 157 MPH.
Since I doubt your commute included a race track filled with the highest end sports cars available in the year 1990 it’s likely you were surrounded by relatively pedestrian commuter vehicles that in no way shape or form were “passing you like nothing” while your CRX was flying along at nearly it’s maximum hypothetical top speed.
Hell many MODERN cars won’t reach 105 thanks to their speed regulators.
You weren’t driving at 105 and the people around you weren’t driving at 120+.
snooggumsThey might have been looking at the kph instead of mph. 65 mph (105 kph) with everyone passing sounds about right.
Depends on what part of Illinois you’re talking about, I’m from southern Illinois and we typically only go about 60/65 on highway and 75/80 on interstate. Chicagoans will honk and pass me while I am doing 80 through 2 lane construction zones, literally happened a couple months ago as I was driving to O’Hare for an overnight flight
That work around is what most states that legalized it have done, they can’t enter roads over 55mph. It’s a reasonable concession, you probably don’t want to take one over 50mph anyway.
Most places in the US are connected by 55 mph roads. I’d be hard-pressed to get anywhere but the city center in most places I’ve lived if I couldn’t use those roads.
Farm equipment uses those roads all the time, and they go even slower, so I don’t think being able to keep up with traffic is a valid concern.
Southern California is entirely navigable by surface streets, but also too, there are plenty of vehicles going only 55 in the slow lanes, which is the speed limit for trucks anyway (though few pay attention to it). I have a '72 camper that can barely do 50, and I take it on the freeway several times a year.
Note that I said over 55, rural connection roads should still be traversable since most are 55. Basically limits them from entering the interstate highways.
I live in one of the most rural states in the country, where loads to haul are generally large and the posted speed limit on the highway is usually 75 mph, and the de facto highway speed is usually 5-10 mph above that. No truck that can barely push 70 is gonna keep up with that. On top of that, you’re dealing with ice and snow on the roads half the year, so you’ll need to be able to deal with that too.
☂️-thats honestly a problem that can be solved with a small turbocharger and a slightly higher msrp, its not like they are ever getting close to the price of one of the huge ones.
They don’t meet the us safety standards. It could mean a lot of things like lacking 5mph bumpers, air bags, abs, etc.
Doesn’t mean they aren’t safe.
Doesn’t mean they aren’t safe.
At just 31MPH a Kei truck gets absolutely clobbered in front offset and side impact safety tests, even against small vehicles like Smart Cars and the old (small) Ford Rangers. Like don’t bother calling an ambulance just the morgue kind of clobbered.
Kei trucks are neat vehicles and I’d like to have one but scientific testing shows that they are not safe.
yet people are killed / injured on european road at much smaller rate than in the US. the least worse US state’s roads are less safe than even the worst canadian province (and canada isnt even good). the US treats its roads like a car crash derby so it needs “higher standards”, but that approach is provably terrible. not only vehicules are huge and wasteful, but the roads remain horribly unsafe as well.
Just because a vehicle doesn’t meet us safety standards doesn’t mean they aren’t safe. It also doesn’t mean they are safe.
Also, aren’t these all 25 years old or older? Safety expectations should be lower.
Here in the states we have legal corruption lobbyists which the auto manufacturers pay to keep cheap vehicles from being used. And then the lawmakers claim safety concerns as the reason.
Different crash standards in US and Europe. Most companies don’t even bother getting cars tested in both because the market demands are so different.
This has got to be the most incorrect comment in the thread