@VoxofGod @wdlindsy @corbden yoooooooooo! WTF. how did, i miss thatā½ā½ā½
i have my Vatican II bible. will check this out sometime today. i wouldn't put it past the RCC to have obfuscated the translation to Spanish.
btw reading one of those hotel bibles as a kid is what got me curious about the wack world of bible translations (enough that i worked translation gigs all throughout my time in academia).
with bibles, it's a wild west out there. really fascinating.
Even Joseph Smith took a crack at a retranslation, from the KJV, from English, with magic prophet powers. Other than some very imaginative rewrites of parts of what I think were supposed to be Genesis, and a few snippets that now exist as footnotes in LDS-published Bibles, he got tired and gave up I guess.
@corbden @VoxofGod @wdlindsy fwiw, my gigs weren't translating the bible, LOL. what i meant is that it got me into translation and to do it. at first it was mostly legal docs. then philosophy & literary works. i studied with Edith Grossman. sheās famous for her translation of El Quijote. learned so much with her about why ethymology matters when choosing synonyms. am really greatful. she made me a better reader and listener.
twas victim of automation. google translate used to be b2b software.
Oh sure, I was replying to what you said about the Wild West of Bible translations, which in JSās case was literally in the Wild West š
Ethymology is a cool word for a concept Iāve thought about but didnāt have a word! Search engines are choking on it (they insist that I mean etymology), but I can tell what it means from context and roots. We lose so much in translation because words arenāt just units that can be directly swapped out across languages without context and meaning loss.
Thatās one of my big gripes about a god who thought it a good idea to give his words in just a few times and places, and expected the billions of people living elsewhere and elsewhen to understand letter-perfect what it meant OR ELSE! Like heās never heard of epistemology [especially hermeneutics] or even just basic neurology.
ā We lose so much in translation because words arenāt just units that can be directly swapped out across languages without context and meaning loss. ā
you sound like Prof. Grossman š
i wonder if she ever wrote a book about translation. she passed away recently, that's why sheās been on my mind.
@blogdiva @corbden @VoxofGod @wdlindsy
Saul of Tarsus was the greatest product hacker of all time.
The first three centuries of the faith system were more interesting than anything that happened after: https://youtu.be/0cYs7IYN9qg?feature=shared
Yeah my semi-joking-but-kinda-serious conspiracy theory is that Paul was an intentional Roman plant and that he faked his whole conversion āmiracleā on the road to Damascus. Itās an easy miracle to fake, and everything the Christians at the time wanted to hear. Then he completely rebooted the doctrines.
I have one theory for Saul, and recently heard another.
Mine: heās a trained Hellenized rabbi and a Roman citizen who was the cause for the first martyr of the faith, Stephen. That heavy conscious of persecution weighed on him. On the road to Damascus, he ate a magic mushroom and hallucinated the vision which changed his life.
Someone else: he suffered from a form of epilepsy which resulted in the same hallucination.
Apparently thereās some solid evidence that the prophet Joseph Smith also benefited from shroom visions, but Iāve not dug into it. A small panel presented that idea at a Sunstone conference I attended, and I poked my head in, but I wanted to see something else more.
@corbden @blogdiva @VoxofGod @wdlindsy
TIL
āIn the Greek world, the word saulos carried a negative connotation when it came to males and meant something like āprancing.ā It seems likely that someone in Antioch gave Saul some valuable advice before he went out among the peoples of the Roman world. Calling oneself āPrancerā when standing before the likes of philosophers and Roman governors would probably not generate a great first impression.ā
https://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/biblical-topics/new-testament/when-did-saul-become-paul/
@20centuryliterarymystery @corbden @blogdiva @VoxofGod @wdlindsy
Appropriation is a great term. Geza Vermesā Christian Beginnings: Nazareth to Nicaea was also eye-opening.
Itās why I refer to Paul as a product hacker.
He never met Jesus, took his message, broke with the actual Apostles, and then conducted product-market fit A/B experiments in Asia Minor, tweaking with each trip out.
James in Jerusalem was pissed.
Paul was like Elon Musk claiming to have founded Tesla.
Totally, and when I used the word ācolonialismā in my original reply, that was carrying a lot of water, including (mis)appropriation. Post-Roman Europe learned colonialism from the Roman Empire, which it passed along through (its version of, starting with Paul) Christianity, upon which this American Empire was eventually built. Many of my European ancestors were converted by force. (Arguably all of them depending on how we define āforce.ā)
Most of these basic tools were first developed in Rome (or before that perhaps, but certainly advanced by Rome), and theyāre only kept alive within American democracy by Christian forces, the only setting in which the word āLordā can still be uttered without being entertainment, roleplay, or farce.
This is my current working model.
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