Gabe BellWho you are is who you are
HildegardeThere is a distinction between real life and online. Psudonimously posting under a screen name is very different from making real life statements as yourself.
If you chose to be yourself online that is your choice. You can be someone else on the internet. You can choose to be an asshole on ocasion, that’s kind of the entire premise of trolling.
There is no ghost inside you, simultaneously piloting the same meat suit you are, who suddenly takes control sometimes.
It’s you. You said those things. You may have been drunk, you may have been anonymous, but you still said them. If you’re willing to go on a racist tirade online, you’re willing to go on a racist tirade. If you’re going to make death threats anonymously, you’re going to make death threats.
Statements remain true without qualifying where, or how. Because you still did a thing, regardless.
Well said
An actor literally says the lines they say, but they are playing a character, those words are not their own. Acting, improv, playing pretend, roleplay, there are plenty of ways for healthy adults to take a role and be a person other than themselves.
Online interactions can do the same thing. Some people choose to be someone else on the internet and that is fine.
The screenshotted comment is from audreyii-fic, someone who chose to represent herself by what is (presumably) her own name. That perspective is very different from the sort of person who would choose to be someone else online.
Be an actor, sure, but an actor isn’t ‘being someone else’ - they’re acting - they’re **pretending ** to be someone else. It is different.
agent_flounderIt is different mainly because everyone knows it if they’re in the play or watching it.
zaphIf you’re in a role play forum and you role play as an asshole, you are correct. If you are on the internet, for example Twitter, and you act like an asshole, it’s because you’re an asshole. Hope that clears up the difference between context.
No. The person choosing to “act” like a dick on the Internet is making the choice to be a dick. They don’t just happen to be a dick in their roleplay or whatever - they’re making that choice.
And it’s not some pretend space where their words and actions don’t count. Being a dick in a multiplayer video game is being a dick to a real person. Being a dick on a forum about a game or show you don’t like is being a dick to real people who play and make those things. You don’t get to copout and say “it’s just a character” when it’s affecting real people. That is your impact on the world. Take some damn responsibility for it.
Also, Audrey II is from Little Shop of Horrors. Check it out if you haven’t. It’s a good flick.
You had to know while you were typing that how full of shit that response is, right? On some level, cognitively, you know you’re grasping at straws here.
An actor literally says the lines they say, but they are playing a character,
Yeah and everyone knows it’s a play. With actors and an audience. Kinda different.
Despite what Shakespeare said, online isn’t a play. Neither is RL. You can still put on a facade or a persona. But in either case it you treat people like shit, you’re an asshole.
Do you say the same about those who role-play in video games? Even if I set out with the intent of being someone else in a RPG, I find myself eventually reflecting my own behavior. It’s hard for me to relate to those who can do a ‘complete asshole’ playthrough. Are these people closet psychopaths?
“Yourself” is the totality of everything you do. You don’t get to do stuff and then decide “No, that wasn’t me, it doesn’t count”. If you that you’re just deluding yourself
OgmiosToo often though, such arguments are used by others in the attempt to define a person by one specific example in ignorance of everything else that person is.
You will always be defined by others as your relationship to them, and the actions they know you take. You will always be more complex than you’re observed to be.
You have little say in how others define you.
I’m talking about personal interactions - online or in person - if that one specific example is the only interaction a person has with you then that’s the only information they have about you. If you don’t want to be classified as an asshole, don’t be an asshole.
How do you define yourself? Do you throw out the anomalies, or weight them in, or something else …?
SplatterphaceThis is straight bullshit.
KallioapinaThats because you fear social consequences in IRL, you COWARD. Dont be asshole to people playing games, even.
WTF? IT’S LITERALLY PART OF THE GAME YOU DOUCHE
theneverfoxAnd ruining someone’s day IRL isn’t very different from doing it virtually. An asshole is an asshole - the scale might be different, but the desire to make someone’s life worse is what makes you an asshole, even if their life isn’t on the line
They can’t even stand up behind their own comments. I recognized their handle from an interaction I had with them the other day where they did the same thing - said something dumb and deleted everything when called out. I was hoping they maybe realized what they said was stupid af, but if they take pride in being a dick, I doubt they have that much insight.
Sometimes being nice is more important than being right.
Nope. Fuck off.
I don’t play minecraft. Explain to me what you do in game as a griefer.
He joins other people’s worlds and destroys the projects that other people have built.
It’s extremely frowned upon, especially because people often spend an incredible amount of time and dedication to build incredibly elaborate projects… and then a griefer shows up and blows up the entire thing.
I’m a little bit surprised that the parent commenter is so nonchalant about admitting that he’s a griefer, since that will get him banned in a lot of servers and because it is definitely not socially acceptable, even online
So an asshole.
What I expected, but I kinda wanted him to justify it and explain how he wasn’t somehow an asshole. Judging by the self deletes comments hopefully he is rethinking his behavior.
Break other people’s creations.
Eh… there are abundant examples of assholes who have learned to pretend to be decent people though.
I think that’s the point, if you’re an asshole online, but tell yourself you’re fine irl. You’re lying to yourself and it shows.
Yea, personal attacks against everyone who disagrees with this ridiculous oversimplification is totally not asshole behaviour.
The ironing is hilarious.
Yes, there is plenty of “ironing” here. I had initially read “you” as being directed at me, but once I recognized my mistake I deleted the comment and corrected my reply, because I do attempt to be fair to others.
Well then that’s a clear example of someone pretending to be something they aren’t, which contradicts the entire premise. Someone can absolutely pretend to be a saint on social media while being full of vitriol inside.
It doesn’t contradict the premise at all. In fact, I think the person I described is the exact person the post is talking about, i.e. someone who is convinced that their actions online don’t translate to who they are irl.
It’s true that one instance of anger doesn’t mean the person is an asshole. The point of the post is that your post history on social media is often a more accurate portrait of your personality irl than some people want to admit.
EdibleFriendI don’t think there is a single person behaves that way online that thinks it doesn’t change the person they are IRL. It’s just online they have the balls to be the person they really want to be.
Oh you sweet summer child. Everyone is the hero of their own adventure.
I never said that they weren’t. I’m just saying I don’t believe anybody looks at their online behavior and thinks ‘thats not the real me that doesn’t count.’
GladiusBI dunno. I agree and I don’t. I am part of a gaming community where RPing and ERPing is a decent chunk of subscribers. It does not appeal to me, but does that make them a catboi that will lick the back of their paws for a million gil? I kinda doubt that.
There is a big difference between me being “Sir Markham of Viewhampton” online, and playing that role as a total dick, and me being me online and me being a total dick.
If I play Sir Markham as a dick who goes out, woes women, wines them and dines them then dumps them for the next bit of tail that comes along, that is clearly a part I am role playing because I am roleplaying him as that.
But if I come on here as me – as Gabe and am rude, obnoxious, racist and a total twat then it is far more likely that is what I am like in real life.
If I roleplay a wizard in an online game do you think that means I can do magic in real life?
Not sure all! However both our scenarios are fairly apparent where fantasy starts and reality ends. But where is that line in other mediums?
I’m not justifying bigotry or anything else you brought up. I completely agree that they are assholes.
But is shittymorph just a shitty wrestling guy?
VinnyDaCatUnexpected XIV.
Honestly, if you’re online enough you do start to feel like a lot of people aren’t authentic, and it’s true enough, but I also think that validates the OP in a way. People are living our their fantasies, and they wouldn’t be fantasies if they weren’t appealing.
Yes! But I’m not a WOL with a mansion. I dunno. I hear the sentiment about being a dick and bigotry. We both know that XIV is not about that life and I am happy it’s that way. However I was going down the wormhole of possible exceptions.
XIV has a lot of content to delve into besides just being either a roleplayer or a raider. There’s definitely some unpleasant individuals in certain circles, but yeah we do usually call them out.
I am a raider through and through. That’s for sure. But I do partake in another nuances.
but does that make them a catboi that will lick the back of their paws for a million gil?
Absolutely it does, you just can’t do that in real life, because catbois, contrary to popular belief, don’t exist, and gillionaire whales willing to fund these ventures also don’t exist.
I think the difference here is that people are more multifaceted than they care to admit, and there is no real “you”. You can just as easily get lost in the sauce of catboi erotic roleplay as many can get lost in the sauce of ironically being a callous asshole. If I have learned anything, it is that irony doesn’t exist, and there is no core “reality”. I mean, there’s like a core physical reality, probably, but that’s not really what I mean.
Gnome KatI duno i have definitely seen people argue the internet isn’t real and none of it counts. I think people definitely try to justify it to themself like that. Like if a trans person complains about online harassment, that argument gets used a lot to dismiss it as lesser or not really important.
EdibleFriend isn’t saying that people don’t make that claim, they are saying that those people are being dishonest when making that claim. That they don’t really believe what they are saying.
Several comments here provide evidence to the contrary.
And maybe that’s the problem. The people who are assholes online don’t think about there being real, earnest people behind the other keyboards.
Anonymity and the abstraction of interacting online can and does weaken the sense of social contract for many people, unfortunately.
And it does count. Because what one says online can and does affect others in a real way.
Actually I just need to address this a little further because this is a beautiful example of what I’m discussing. All I did was post my opinion and you came along being a condescending ass about it. Do you believe that doesn’t count towards who you really are?
Wow so touchy. Not only was that condescending, it was lighthearted. Yet you’re just too fucking miserable to not make it about you huh?
And there’s some very hostile toxicity and insults.
Again…is this not the real you? Do you believe that?
Allow me to come in and analyze both of your conversations.
Firstly, I think you probably misinterpreted the “sweet summer child” thing. I think it is pretty lighthearted, but I do understand how it could come off condescending. You were the first to use an insult, though, for calling the person an ass.
On the other hand, the person also engaged in insult throwing, by calling you too fucking miserable to take something lightly.
Finally, do I think either of you would’ve thrown such tantrums in the real world over such a stupid issue? Absolutely not. Do I think both of you are complete assholes for being assholes to each other online, based on misinterpretation of tone? Also no. Would I talk like this in real life, butting into a conversation I’m not a part of, offering my opinion that nobody asked for, and generally being annoying? Also no.
Does it mean I’m annoying in real life? Probably still yes. But I also think that you are probably not both assholes IRL.
I’ll be honest maybe it was a little lighthearted but… At the same time still condescending and there was no need for it in relation to my perfectly innocent opinion on this post. Especially when it comes down to it he clearly didn’t understand my opinion because ’ everyone is the hero of their own story’ honestly completely fits with my point of ’ people don’t look at their online behavior has not actually being the real them.’
When people are complete assholes on the internet they feel justified. When people said death threats on Instagram they partially believe they were doing the right thing.
And I’ll be honest… Yep. I behave like this in person too. If somebody’s condescending to me I call them on it so… Yep. I would have behaved just like this in person.
Thank you for actually talking rationally about this though :)
I agree with you that people believe their death threats are justified, and probably aren’t like “oh that’s not me in real life.”
But also, for me personally, I find it way easier to be an asshole online than in real life. I’ve definitely said things online (thrown insults, name-calling, etc) that I would never say in real life, and I would probably say, “that’s not really who I am.” But it is, because I said it. But it also isn’t, because I was younger and dumber and more emotionally unregulated. Yes, it was still me who said it. But when you see someone’s face, you see their expressions, their body language, you see them as a human rather than a username. And I understand for me, personally, that I’m more likely to be a dick behind a screen than to someone’s face absolutely unconsciously, so I’ll give someone else the benefit of the doubt there, as well.
In the end I would probably push back against the notion that we are always one person. We all should be capable of kindness and sternness, gentleness and seriousness, somberness and goofiness.
So in regards to your point, I absolutely would use that language in real life and no one I know would be offended by the words ‘sweet summer child’ unless maybe English was their second language. If EdibleFriend responded by calling me an ass and we weren’t in public he would be on the floor very quick. And likely would if he said that to anybody. Analyze that how you will.
I mean, I would also use sweet summer child in real life. I have. But people don’t always know it’s a joke, and I understand that. I certainly wouldn’t deck them if they called me an ass, that seems a bit extreme. Probably would go on the verbal defensive, try to explain it was a joke, and feel bad that they took it the wrong way.
But if that’s how you carry yourself through life, I can only say I feel bad for you that someone else’s words would affect you so much as to prompt you to physically assault them. Just seems a bit silly, doesn’t it.
Oh, you sweet summer child.
Careful, you’re gonna be on the floor soon buddy 😠😠
Would I talk like this in real life, butting into a conversation I’m not a part of, offering my opinion that nobody asked for
That’s not super fair to yourself - makes me realize we all have special privileges here… we’re all not part of 99% of conversations yet we’re all welcome to become a part of about 100% of conversations anyway.
BTW I think of our behaviors as drivers as somewhat analogous.
When was the last time somebody cut you off in traffic?
When was the last time somebody cut in front of you in a grocery store?
Spend an hour in traffic, spend an hour in a grocery store… experience entirely different parts of people. A cage (car) and removal from direct interaction (internet) both change our psychology ever so bigly.
I think you’re right on the money in terms of relating the Internet to the car. It’s so similar. Like, why am I calling the person in front of me an asshole for cutting me off? I’ve done that a million times to others. I’m just as bad as them. But because I can’t see them and they can see me, I feel freer with my emotions and words. I think it’s similar with communication on the Internet.