cavemanMacron leads the way to Western civilization’s suicide
deegeeseLOL @ Russia lecturing anyone else on birth rates and human rights.
Yes, it’s all cynical, but interesting to see.
Specially when many communist/socialist militants but every Russian idea, while Russias ideals are totally against to what communists in West want
How about you just admit that you’re anti-abortion instead of trying to frame this Russian propaganda as interesting.
I’m also anti abortion, if abortion is seem as contraceptives. That’s why there are condoms.
In case of rape or fetus death or seriously mental or health issues on fetus I’m for allowing abortion
How generous of you, except that those who you align with aren’t so generous and your claim that this should be state by state leads to the literal rape victims going to jail for losing a pregnancy through no fault of their own. In short, you have no business in these discussions because yours is untrustworthy opinion.
Well, you obviously won’t get it thru nationwide voting because you don’t have enough votes… your only chance is state-wide vote.
Or move to Europe.
queermunist she/herSomething I’ve been thinking about recently, maybe you can help-
If you believe abortion is murder, then it seems you believe it is okay to murder the children of rapists.
I said in case of rape I’m for abortion.
This whole abort: yes or no is stupid. It depends on situation.
I am against abortion as contraceptive. For other edge cases I’m open to it.
If your moral beliefs about murder are circumstantial, they’re not your morals, they’re your opinions.
If you truly believe abortion is murder, rape babies have a right to be born.
If you believe in exceptions for rape, shows what you really care about is controlling women. Basically “the only moral abortion is my own”.
No, it means I am against, but in the case that the women didn’t have a choice (like rape), I’d be sorry for the baby and be very sad, it would still be bad for the child, but I’d accept it with a heavy heart for the child
You’re playing word games here. Is it murder to abort a rape baby?
If you accept it with a heavy heart, you’re acknowledging abortion is not murder.
Murder is wrong, but your ”heavy heart” does not justify taking away a woman’s right to control her body.
Well, if I kill someone In a car crash, depending if I did it on purpose or not, of the person I killed was trying to commit a crime against me or not, I I get different legal consequences.
This is a women/couple aborts because of rape, it was clearly not her intention to be raped and she should not be treated as someone who aborted by thinking “whatever, I just don’t like this fetus”
Sounds like you want to ban rape as a way of controlling women’s sexuality.
Well, only spoiled children want to do whatever they want and don’t be accountable for it.
If you can’t use your brain to take Biology into account before having unprotected sex while fertile, I suggest you remove your uterus
Did you even read anything they said?
Please explain yourself. Why are you for abortion in the case of rape and why are you against abortion as contraceptive?
By abortion as contraceptive I mean “I don’t want to use a condom, I’ll just abort later”. I am against that.
If someone don’t want to have a child, just use a condom, or do a vasectomy, or remove the uterus, or use a intra uterine device, or any other method, but don’t banalize it with the mindset “whatever, I’ll just abort it later”
Yes, I already knew what you meant.
I want the why. What’s wrong with the mindset “whatever, I’ll just abort it later” and why are you against it?
I mean, if the fetus is 2 or 2 weeks old (I can’t pinpoint an exact date, would have to ask some doctors), for me it’s clearly not a person, cannot feel pain and has no instinct of self preservation. In this case a “next day pill” or something similar wouldn’t be bad for in my view.
Up to which week of pregnancy and which conditions would you think it’s ok to abort, and above hoe many weeks and conditions would you say it’s not ok to abort?
Okay, so survival instinct and pain response? Like any animal? I guess I get that, I’m vegan after all.
But that leaves a gaping hole in your justification for a fetus conceived from rape. They develop the same as any fetus. What’s the difference? Isn’t this literally a case of punishing the fetus for the sins of the father?
As for me, I don’t believe any restrictions on abortion are legitimate and recognize pregnancy as a burden that the fetus has no right to inflict it on anybody. Personhood is irrelevant to me because abortion is self defense.
I don’t talk I’m terms of sin because it makes no sense for me.
Yes, a women has rights over her body, but a fetus is clearly not her body. A women would not remove her liver or her legs. The fetus depends on her body, but is not her body. A doctor cannot turn off a life support system on a patience just by saying "its my life support device "
For me there’s a collision of rights: the rights of the women to her body, the right of the baby to it’s life, the right of the father to not have his child murdered (if he opposed it).
The fact the a women/human has much more power over a defenseless baby doesn’t change the collision of rights, specially when since 1970 12 million babies were killed in abortion.
For me there should be conditions in which it’s cirminalized and conditions in which it’s not.
Yes, a women has rights over her body, but a fetus is clearly not her body. A women would not remove her liver or her legs. The fetus depends on her body, but is not her body. A doctor cannot turn off a life support system on a patience just by saying "its my life support device "
Pregnancy is a harm being inflicted and we have a right to defend ourselves from harm. It is self defense. A doctor does not have the right to kill in defense of property, but we all have the right to kill in defense of our bodies.
You are not answering the other, much bigger question. Why is a fetus conceived by rape less deserving of life? I say you’re punishing the fetus for the sins of the father because you’re condemning it to death. Why?
If pregnancy is harm inflicted, why would a women inflict harm on herself? You can’t self defense against yourself.
She got pregnant because she wanted or didnt bother enough to prevent it. If she doesn’t want to get harmed, use a preservative.
About rape: I don’t use the word sin because it’s religious. I am not condening it to death, the mother aborting is. But in this case as It was not her choice to get raped, so obvious she should not be treated as if it was her choice.
If pregnancy is harm inflicted, why would a women inflict harm on herself? You can’t self defense against yourself.
I’m granting the fetus personhood and saying that, even when we do that, termination is justified because it is self defense. The fetus is a person invading my body, mutilating my body, and causing pain to my body. Under this formulation, pregnancy is an incredible mercy and sacrifice made for us even though we don’t deserve to have been born.
But in this case as It was not her choice to get raped, so obvious she should not be treated as if it was her choice.
So it’s about punishing women for having unsafe sex?
That doesn’t explain why it’s okay to kill the fetus, though. The fetus didn’t choose to be conceived from rape. Why does it deserve to die?
2)Who said it’s ok to kill the fetus? I just said the mother who is victim rape cannot suffer the same consequence as one who didn’t bother.
Or are you in proposing they should be both criminalized the same?
if the fetus is invading the body z just don’t make it then. It’s not self defense to terminate it, unless you are saying you are defending yourself from yourself, which means you are your own agressor. If it’s a big sacrifice, just don’t get pregnant.
Consent can always be revoked, which means it’s self-defense even if I changed my mind about getting pregnant. I’m defending myself against the fetus. It has no right to use my body against my will, even if I changed my mind.
Pregnancy is a mercy and you should be grateful for being born, not feel like you’re entitled to it.
2)Who said it’s ok to kill the fetus? I just said the mother who is victim rape cannot suffer the same consequence as one who didn’t bother.
You are. You 're literally saying that abortion is acceptable in cases of rape, which means you believe its okay to kill a fetus conceived by rape.
So, once you consent, them you stop consenting and kill a life.
You have no empathy for a child, this is better you will never get one. It’s not a game.
If your mother had aborted I wouldn’t have to hear this selfish arguments
So if you can’t give a baby a right over it’s body just because you are more powerful and needed the convenience of it, what makes you think that some lawmaker should give you a right over your body, given the the lawmakers are much more powerful than you?
You don’t want to show mercy to a defenseless child, but expecy mercy towards you?
Even if a fetus has a right to it’s body, it does not have a right to mine. My right to my body means a fetus can’t use my body against my will. No one is allowed to use my body without my permission, and if they try I will fucking kill them.
I don’t expect mercy from my enemies. I’m not some liberal, I know how politics work. I expect I am going to have to fight for my rights.
This means that when you abort you should then not destroy the baby body. But if you see an abortion vídeo then the baby is destroyed and killed.
And you first allow a baby to enter you body, then you change mind and want to take it out, you can. Then put it in am incubator and pay the machinery and find a family which wants to take care of it. But once you “fucking kill it”, you are going to court.
If you don’t like the fact that your uterus will produce babies and you don’t want to go to court, then “fucking remove your uterus” before you make a baby and blame it for your lack of care
And if the condom fails, is abortion then okay?
I don’t have anything against the next day pill or abortion on the first 2/3 monthes
Well, isn’t “abortion on the first three months” just a long version of what is meant in general when talking about abortion?
It’s e.g. a 7th-month-abortion really a thing in your country or any country at all?
If you see the discussion here, there was people defending abort at any time, under any circumstances (ie, on the 8th month just because “I changed my mind”)
NataliePortlandRussian propaganda about France doesn’t belong in this community
Russian propaganda is exactly the same as Republican propaganda, which is also American.
So what you’re saying is Russia speaks for you on moral issues?
No, I’m staying in this case Russia speaks like republican, and has the guts to go against woke movement.
I like to see people with guts against too much leftist drama and with guts against too much right wing drama.
I’m curious what does “woke movement” mean to you that you need Russia to be your moral guide?
I don’t need Russia to be my moral guide. You are too religious about ideologies.
Take some deep breath and relax.
Hakuna matata
No, you said you admire Russia for being “anti woke”. What does that mean? I find it’s usually a dog whistle for racists and homophobes but perhaps I’ve unkindly prejudged you.
First, thanks for the tone of being open to listen.
What I mean is:
An American person would never have have enough room to bring a controversial opinion on taboo topics.
So for instance an American would not have room to challenge the pro-aboriton or usage of neopronouns (because left says it’s a taboo to go against it)
And also an American would not have room to go against pro- Israel snetiment (because right say it’s a taboo to go against it).
So it takes a non-western press to break the taboo.
Every civilization/people/group/country has some taboos which make them blind. And only external civilizations can challenge that.
I hope my answer was par with the level of trust you gave me.
If not, I’m sorry
It sounds like you’re saying Americans don’t have the freedom to voice unpopular opinions.
Respectfully, that’s a load of BS.
I hear PLENTY from people wanting to outlaw abortion or even birth control. When I say “Free Palestine” I may have to debate someone who supports ethnic cleansing, but that is the hallmark of healthy dialogue.
Americans don’t need to get their talking points from Russia.
NovaPrimeYou make a lot of assumptions of Americans and commit the same binary-choice fallacy you claim you’re against.
Also, just because you say topics are “taboo” does not make them so. That sounds like empty talking points. Supporting non-hetero-normative freedom of self-expression, supporting a woman’s right to choose (and let’s be clear, there’s no such thing as “pro-abortion,” that is propaganda marketing just as “pro-life” is, and used by the same side), contesting open genocide and flaunting of international law and order…these are no “taboo” topics. They’re acknowledgment of basic human rights that one side has made into personal, political, and culture wars for some reason. It is absurd to label them “taboo” topics in much the same way that calling rape a taboo topic would be.
About pro abortion and pro life being Marketing terms I agree…for instance,.some politicians want to ban abortion of fetus without brains under the motto “anti abortion”, but for me this is bullshit.
Up to which week of pregnancy and which conditions would you think it’s ok to abort, and above hoe many weeks and conditions would you say it’s not ok to abort?
Me personally? I can’t ever carry a child physically, so I don’t feel that my opinion should ever matter at the individual level (and imo, the choice should always be at the individual level and not societal/political level). Asking for black letters rules and laws for something as gray as abortion is nonsensical imo. There are too many factors and too many circumstantial details that go into a decision like that. I don’t personally believe that having a blanket rule (even with exceptions, which are just mini blanket rules within the rule) makes sense because everyone’s situation will be different. I’m firmly of the opinion that the person carrying the potential child physically is the only person whose opinion matters. And to be even more “radical,” I’m of the opinion that they should not need an excuse or justification to make that decision. It is their body that acts as the host and they, and they alone, should be the ones who make decisions about their bodies. Full stop.
mojofrododojoSo for instance an American would not have room to challenge the pro-aboriton or usage of neopronouns (
what the fuck are you talking about? you can advocate your view - we have freedom of speech, the government won’t stop you.
There’s tons of pro and anti-israeli sentiment to be found.
You just don’t’ want people to criticize you, and your idiotic decisions.
You don’t get that here. Go to russia if you want that.
Yeah, this is a US news and politics community, not sure why random news about France is here…
France has just made abortion, already legal, a constitutional right – a sign of the country’s morbid drive to self-destruction
LOL, check out this Neanderthal. Although I’m guessing even Neanderthal’s were more evolved.
And it’s also ridiculous that Putin is killing so much peole and defending life here.
He’s probably just speaking what Russian population wants to hear
Neanderthals were the smart ones.
downpunxxrt.com fuck off, al jazeera.com likewise fuck right off
I'm sure that Russia Today is entirely unbiased about a member of the EU and NATO /s
All countries are biased towards their world-view/interests