ZeroCoolNick Offerman Slams ‘Homophobic Hate’ Against His ‘The Last of Us’ Episode: ‘It’s Not a Gay Story. It’s a Love Story, You A–hole!’
WaxedWookieI’m impressed by pretty much everything I see from Offerman, and his role in TLOU was fantastic. It had real impact, and didn’t feel at all like the lazy tokenistic drivel that’s become Disney’s standard fare.
I’ll tell you why:
Because it, kind of like Brokeback Mountain all those years earlier, appreciates that homosexuality and the gay community are not one in the same. While the gay community is extremely important and should never be downplayed, media always tends depict gay people as connected to it or at the very least evoking many of the same aspects and tropes.
This isn’t an unfair thing to depict, far from it, but it has the unfortunate result of making many gay characters feels rather same-y, occasionally even one note.
Offerman’s character depicts a very accurate thing that doesn’t get as much attention in media: the straight acting man discovering his sexuality late in life. With the exception of his piano playing and his penchant for wine and setting the table for elaborate dinners, his character has none of the telltale “gay” aspects you typically find in media, nor does he develop them. In fact his character aspects (survivalist, paranoid, even a hint conservative) are generally not associated with gay characters, out of fear of depicting them in a poor light.
That’s not at all to suggest other depictions of gay men are wrong or bad, Bartlett’s character is very well done too. The characters of Bill just feels more notable and fresher in our current media landscape because we see it far less often.
Transporter Room 3piano playing
Fellas, is it gay to play an instrument?
I know that’s not what you’re saying I just thought it was a funny way to phrase it
Also, is liking wine gay?
helenslunchI often prefer wine because beer gives me near-instant hiccups and bloating.
That being said, wine is definitely socially associated with femininity and homosexuality. Beer is what a man drinks. That plus the piano and the other things they mentioned might tickle someone’s gaydar for sure.
SatyrSackhomosexuality and the gay community are not one in the same
I think a lot of people don’t understand that being GSRM does not automatically make you part of the LGBT community.
I loved the episode but it is very much a gay story
Do you also refer to romantic stories between man and a woman (traditionally referred to as “love stories”) as “heterosexual stories”?
If I were asked to qualify one, sure. It’s a love story about a gay couple. It’s a gay love story. If they were Indonesian it would be an Indonesian love story.
Cyv_The story isn't about them being gay. Its about them being in love and dealing with the post apocalyptic bullshit along with their relationship. To call it a "gay story" is to single out the one tiny part of it that is them being gay and reduce the whole thing to that. I doubt you'd just classify Schindlers list as a "Jew story" or Black panther as a "Black story". I do like how you slipped from it being a "gay story" to a "gay love story" tho, nice save. The quote was about people calling it a gay story, not a gay love story. I think even subconsciously you understand that "gay story" is not really a good way to summarize that story.
In no world is somebody asking for more detail on a story going to want to hear "its a gay story" and be satisfied. If they want details you'd tell them more, and if they didn't a more accurate summary would be "love story" or even "post apocalyptic gay love story" but just "gay story" is like calling lord of the rings a "travel diary"
That argument is a bit like the idea of colorblindness when it comes to discussing race, however. It doesn’t do justice to be dismissive of identity in the name of equality because that ignores the different social contexts that are inherent to that identity.
I would say the fact that it is a gay love story is very significant to note for that particular episode given the time period that The Last of Us takes place in. What I mean is: society collapses in summer of 2003 in the Last of Us TV series (10 years earlier than the game). These characters are living in Massachusetts, which is one of the first states to recognize gay marriage, but would not have occurred until late 2003 if society hadn’t collapsed almost overnight earlier that year. Obergefell v. Hodges would be another 12 years off, making widespread legitimacy of gay marriage a distant fantasy.
These two characters, effectively, had to live their entire lives closeted in a broadly homophobic society that would not recognize them. But it was after the collapse of that society that they were at liberty to be their true selves and, as we see, become happier after the apocalypse than they were before. It would not be the same story at all if it was turned into a hetero relationship.
You see, if they had mady ANY commentary about all of that stuff you said, THEN I’d be OK throwing “gay” on “love story”. But it didn’t.
Being gay was not a critical part of the story, no matter how much people celebrate it for that. It WAS NOT an important part of the story, even if it was an important part of why people got emotional over the episode.
The ENTIRE POINT is that the episode was otherwise normal. That’s what Offerman is saying. It’s NOT a gay story. It’s a love story where the characters happened to be men. If society were actually progressive, “love story” would be far more accurate, because that’s all that happened.
It’s okay to clarify and specify when something is gay.
Its clearly its own sub genre, Netflix has specific categories for it and Asian culture has an acronym (BL for boy love). Many people prefer it over the rest, even without being gay themselves.
Acknowledging a difference isn’t necessarily an insult.
The ENTIRE POINT is that it is NOT from the “gay” culture, you numpties. You are CHOOSING to miss the entire point.
It is NOT a “gay” story. It’s a homosexual love story. The fact you don’t know there even is a difference says a lot about how far you need to grow.
[Insert County ]love story
A teen love story
A divorcee love story
Yes. We do this for all types of shit all the time. Just because you put gay in front of it doesn’t make you homophobic.
So a post-apocalyptic love story? Cuz that seemed to be the main theme. Unless you were just too caught up over the characters being gay to notice.
Offermans character was deep in the closet and his future husband had to break down some heavy emotional walls. It was his first relationship with a man.
Being gay was very much part of the theme and wasn’t just some offhand detail about them imo.
There was a lot to the episode but pretending their sexuality had no impact on how the story was told or its impact is silly. I don’t think it would have been as touching without it.
Some of you really need a rewatch.
You should really rewatch it, because the genders could be changed and it’d still be a good episode.
No mattrr how much people whine or gloat about it, the gayness wasn’t required. It’s not a “gay” story. That’s the entire point Offerman is making.
I disagree.
The characters involved happen to be gay, but there's nothing in the scenarios that are exclusive to gay couples. The same messages can be taken from it even if they were a hetero couple.
tryptaminev 🇵🇸 🇺🇦 🇪🇺Hetero couples do have the added difficulty of scoring contraceptives in a post apocalyptic world though.
And gay people are safer without enemas and douches? Nevermind hiv treatments?
Lets be real. In a post apocalyptic world HIV will go untreated and with that it will be a quick death sentence. Especially if we are talking about a zombie infection making rounds.
THE MASTERMINDOfferman is becoming more and more a chad in my eyes and that love story was really really good and its coming from someone who really hates comedy and romance genre but gotta say it was really good.
FenrirIIIRead his books, but only if you’re a lefty. I showed my boomer parents and they hated it.
Which books ?
I’ve listened to Paddle Your Own Canoe on audiobook (he narrates). Dunno about the rest, but I’d agree based on that one. He makes it clear pretty quickly that Ron Swanson was just a character and his views are different and more nuanced.
The only similarities between Nick Offerman and Ron Swanson are his giggle and his faithfulness to his friends.
Wood working and a very erotically charged relationship with Megan Mulally too
And he really does play the saxophone.
Nick Offerman has always been Cool and Good
Also good and cool
When did “a Chad” become a positive term? From my experince growing up it was a mid-west term for rich city kids, and then later on the internet it became a red piller/incel term for “Alpha male”.
Is this one of those “taking it back” and owning it things to take power away from red pillers & incels?
Nick Offerman:
I’ve enjoyed the hell out of his content. I loved it when Adam Savage did a shop tour with him. I’ve also listened to his Twain’s Feast audiobook and enjoyed the hell out of that. The historical journey through American regional cuisine was amazing. And how much we’ve actually lost is even more amazing.
Cosmic ClericWhen did “a Chad” become a positive term? From my experince growing up it was a mid-west term for rich city kids, and then later on the internet it became a red piller/incel term for “Alpha male”.
It was a love story and it was touching. I had to look away during the intimate scenes as watching two guys making out gives me the heebie jeebies.
You are a weak person
You are what’s wrong with “progressive” or “left” or lgbt friendly circles. Fuck your judgement, you pathetic asshole. Public displays of affection give MANY people the heebie jeebies, regardless of gender, you judgemental prick.
A love story without affection sounds hollow. The original comment specifically singled out an expression of affection displayed by gay characters in a romance story, they did not say in their original comment that public affection in general is what bothers them. That led me to believe they have some homophobic feelings in their original comment, which is where my response came from. With either original intention, be it a distaste for love stories or homophobic origins, you’re quite aggressively upset. I suggest maybe you don’t watch love stories if you don’t like public displays of affection, just a thought.
You are the one coming in here and being hostile. I’m just giving in kind. People don’t have to have personal issues to not want to stare at others making out.
You are just further showing how judgemental without thought you are. You have failed to mature and fundamentally understand that others do not have the same perspective as you.
Shame on you for pretending to have the high road.
raccoona_nongrataI was glad they took the time to dedicate an episode to Bill’s relationship, in the game it was just a note you find, but it’s a part of Bill’s story that really illustrates his character and why he is the way he is in many ways.
Glad to see Offerman standing up for decency, though it’s not a giant surprise since he’s always seemed like a good guy.
I remember when it was coming out, and everyone on reddit was going gaga over how faithful to the story it was.
Then that episode came out and everyone loved it, so as someone who didn’t play the games, naturally I wondered if it was in the game, as that had been apparently of utmost importance to the fans.
But merely asking “was it in the game?” got an army of angry people calling me every name in the book.
I never even watched the show because I thought that was just so fucking stupid. Fans ruin every franchise.
The episode was directed by the same guy who directed all of “It’s a Sin”, another incredible bit of telly.
I don’t know how anyone could watch that episode and see anything other than an absolutely heart wrenching tale of love and how beautiful and sad and even stupid it can be. You don’t even have to be gay to identify with it, you just have to be human.
I dunno. I really like the episode, but Frank was super manipulative and it felt like Bill was being romance-conned.
I agree, and that complexity is part of why I loved the episode so much. It feels bittersweet, because I get the sense that if not for the whole world ending, Frank could’ve easily spent his whole life in the closet. It was cute to see him navigating a relationship with the same sweetness of a teenager with their first love, but that also comes with there being a pretty significant emotional maturity gap between Bill and Frank.
That by itself isn’t an issue (and because of varying degrees to which LGBTQ people feel safe to be out, varying levels of romantic or sexual experience is a fairly common theme I’ve seen within the community irl), but I also think there were some iffy vibes in the dynamic which went unchallenged, likely because neither of them wanted to disrupt a dynamic that they felt lucky to have.
It reminded me a lot of a lesbian friend of mine who stayed with her first girlfriend for way too long because they were the only two out lesbians in the tiny town. They were an awful fit for each other and they stayed together for years longer than they should’ve because they felt like there weren’t any other options (and indeed, there wasn’t really, not in that town).
So overall, Frank and Bill’s story was a beautiful and sweet story of love blooming in improbable circumstances, but it also had nuance from the subtle darker undertone to the relationship. For me, it highlighted that ultimately this was a tragic love story, and the tragedy was only partly caused by the zombie apocalypse.
As all good love story, it’s complex and withultiple facades, which made it even more realistic and well-written
I find it to be a great 1 hour of television, but due to Frank’s manipulative nature and the aforementioned romance con it felt like, I wouldn’t classify it as a good love story.
Stop acknowledging it, Nick. Embody Ron Swanson at Home Depot for just a moment. Some internet freak is complaining about the Frank/Bill episode of TLOU? Is breathing life into their argument by acknowledging it above or below Ron Swanson’s pay grade? Does he in fact “know more than you”?
Nah. Disagree. I’m gay, and as much as I wish we didn’t, we need people to stand up there and say, no, fuck you. This is a love story. They just love each other.
As much as I agree with your sentiment, anti-gay bigotry is nothing new, and will never go away. Let bigots scream themselves red in the face.