L4sBotFeb 11, 2024

Shell Is Immediately Closing All Of Its California Hydrogen Stations | The oil giant is one of the big players in hydrogen globally, but even it can't make its operations work here.

https://lemmy.world/post/11840366

Shell Is Immediately Closing All Of Its California Hydrogen Stations | The oil giant is one of the big players in hydrogen globally, but even it can't make its operations work here. - Lemmy.World

Shell Is Immediately Closing All Of Its California Hydrogen Stations | The oil giant is one of the big players in hydrogen globally, but even it can’t make its operations work here.::The oil giant is one of the big players in hydrogen globally, but even it can’t make its operations work here. All seven of its California stations will close immediately.

Show threadjuneFeb 11, 2024

As two major manufacturers double down on developing hydrogen cell cars.

The complaints about electric infrastructure not being ready for widespread adoption but people championing hydrogen cell just boggles my mind.

Show threaddaqqadFeb 12, 2024

What part of that confuses you? Hydrogen is better for cars VS batteries in every meaningful way in 2024. Long range, quick fill ups, zero harmful emissions, don’t need to live in SFH or rely on landlord/HOA to grant you the privilege of charging your car.

Hydrogen cell cars are electric cars that don’t rely on severely underdeveloped technology of batteries we have today.

Show threadoortjunkFeb 12, 2024

Yes! A clean platform that needs METRIC GIGATONS of carbon positive infrastructure to set up and maintain. That is why I call shenanigans on your zero harmful emissions claim.

VS

We already have wires, and batteries are more than good enough for a vast swath of the everyday commuting public.

Show threaddaqqadFeb 12, 2024

Hydrogen can be generated any time. Like when nuclear or solar or wind energy is otherwise going to waste. We don’t have and likely won’t have batteries that could replace it for decades.

Modern batteries are absolute shit and definitely not good enough. I think a good indication that batteries are anywhere near useful will be when you can fly on battery power across the Atlantic.

Show threadLaurel Raven

Wait, so … They’re nowhere near useful when we can already use them for daily commuting easily because of some arbitrary goalpost for an unrelated transportation method? How does that even make sense?

Infrastructure for hydrogen fueling requires production facilities, trucks to transport, and stations set up, to even start moving one vehicle let alone taking over any percentage of commuter traffic of any significance. EV fueling infrastructure requires… Pretty much the same grid we already have, at least as a functional baseline (yes, it needs improvements, but we’re not switching overnight so we have the time we need to make those changes; meanwhile, it’s already functional)

Feb 12, 2024 at 5:37amWeb
Show threaddaqqadFeb 12, 2024

It isn’t arbitrary. Just a simplified example of stored energy to weight ratio.

Infra would show up if people didn’t jump on wrong tech just like electric charging infra is starting to show up.

Show threadLaurel RavenFeb 12, 2024

There’s that subjective “wrong tech” again

And again, the wholesale infrastructure needed is what I’m talking about, not the infrastructure availability.

Again: hydrogen requires, at a minimum, production facilities, trucking to distribution nodes, and fueling stations to get the fuel to the consumer.

Electricity… Is already being delivered. It just needs a way to plug in.

This has precisely zero to do with which tech has been “jump[ed] on”.

Show threaddaqqadFeb 15, 2024
I’m talking about public infra, not charging at home since most people cannot charge at home. Almost the same amount of infra is required since current capacities are nowhere near sufficient. So it has everything to do with people jumping on wrong tech and money being wasted on useless infra.