One of my dear friends is a state scientist for California. In California if you trust state park beaches to not poison your kids and your dogs, if you appreciate companies getting cited and brought into line for dumping toxic pollutants in your backyard, if you align with all the ambitions we have in this state to meet climate goals -- who do you think is doing that work? It's state scientists who have been massively underpaid for years
Engineers make about 30% more doing the same work.
The labor actions for people like state scientists -- a much more gender balanced group than other specialist fields like engineering -- receive considerably less attention than other actions. One of the things I study is how biased beliefs about fields & abilities interfere with innovation and equity in rewarding achievement. This is textbook; we devalue the bio and life sciences and fields like ecology, work that keeps us from being poisoned by our food and water.
https://calmatters.org/environment/2023/11/california-scientists-strike/
I know these people personally and let me tell you it is gutwrenching to hear your friends talk about tracing salmonella outbreaks and protecting our ecosystem one day and then worrying about getting groceries for their kids the next. These are incredibly skilled scientists keeping California safe and protecting the future.
I wish that the male dominated workforces that get considerably more power and access to power, like engineers, ever showed solidarity with scientists.
Here are more details on the pay disparities. "In California’s agencies, scientists and engineers often work side-by-side on state projects. Both fields generally require high levels of specialized education and technical expertise, and non-partisan analysts and the state’s personnel administrators have noted overlaps between the classifications."
https://calmatters.org/environment/2022/02/california-scientists-battle-pay-disparities/
The fight to be classified as "the right kind of" technical -- it's quite poignant to me. I face this gut punch every day as a scientist even in tech.
"She has been trying to be reclassified as an engineer ever since, she said. For Toms, becoming a scientist for the state of California gave her an added sense of purpose — and “an absolutely gut-punching salary cut.”
The Professional Engineers in California Government union [...] would not comment on the pay disparity."
@grimalkina Pretty similar in Germany. State employees are paid according to a set of salary tables that classifies roles by level and years of employment (progression stops after 6 years). But there's no distinction between scientific and technical staff. As a head of department I would make around 60% of what I earn now.
On a personal note: I'm so happy to see other people with a scientific background (and still doing science like you) in tech. It's so much needed. Well, maybe not so much theoretical chemistry but humanities and social sciences 🥹
@sashag one thing that's wild in this case is that scientific supervisors actually got a pretty dramatic pay disparity fix (over 40% in some cases) but the state is just happily keeping the individual scientists in limbo for years because they know nobody gives af about scientists.
Thank you for the kind words ❤️ I'm happy to be here and to have kind folks like you around me creating a new kind of tech industry than I've experienced in the past. It really makes a difference to me!!
@grimalkina I'm an engineer. And I think engineers are generally overpaid compared to almost everyone.
Trying to get robots to accomplish even simple tasks makes it clear that even relatively simple things are challenging to do well in many different ways, across many different competencies.
The delta in contribution made is tiny compared to the earnings delta.
And no-one should be worrying about affording food for their kids.
(The media never reflects that view, though.)
Attached: 4 images California Association of Professional Scientists fighting for a fair contract with the state. #ValueScientists #CADEM #Sacramento
Dally Ogami
Cat Hicks
Sasha Göbbels 🐿️
BarbChamberlain
Robotistry
Noah Gibbs
Brian Krohne