Bread and CircusesYep.
Ipso Facto@breadandcircuses Actually, it makes me wonder why there haven’t been more protests for all of the violent conflicts on this list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts What is it about this particular conflict, which has taken far fewer lives than other conflicts, that has stirred people so much? Apparently those other conflicts need better pr people to get the word out. Humanity failed long before now.
Jeff Shaffer CBET, ret@IpsoFacto @breadandcircuses Exactly. War is always the wrong answer. I have to wonder, though, what is the right answer when an attack results in mass murder of innocent children and beheading babies occurs? Hamas had to know an overreaction from Netanyahu’s military would result. Was this a public relations ploy? Does hate corrode the vessel that holds it so completely that it makes knowingly setting up the sacrifice of thousands of your own for the satisfaction of revenge on a few seem worthwhile?
HeavenlyPossum@IpsoFacto @breadandcircuses @CivilityFan
Don’t murder kids, for a start
@HeavenlyPossum @breadandcircuses @CivilityFan I agree. Tell that to Hamas. Tell that to all the combatants across the globe who kill kids and even recruit young people into their wars. My issue is if people only started giving a shit about kids dying was because of Israel’s attacks but stayed silent re: Hamas, or are completely ignorant of other conflicts, then they don’t actually give a shit about kids but are looking to express anti-semitism.
@breadandcircuses @CivilityFan @IpsoFacto
This is not an unreasonable concern—it’s probably not a coincidence that the world’s only Jewish state is also the target of a disproportionate level of attention to its abuses when a great many other actors engage in comparable abuses.
That said, this doesn’t make Israel’s abuses any less worthy of condemnation. These two things can both be true at the same time. Everyone should *stop fucking killing innocent people.*
@HeavenlyPossum I never claimed Israel shouldn’t be condemned or doesn’t deserve condemnation for their actions. I will add, however, that if Israel’s response was to commit wholesale genocide then they have failed miserably. If their response was to target children then they have failed miserably. Estimates are that 30% of fatalities are children in a territory that is 50% children. Yes, people should stop killing people. Easier to say when not in the crosshairs.
> “If their response was to target children then they have failed miserably. Estimates are that 30% of fatalities are children in a territory that is 50% children.”
This is among the more depraved things I’ve read today. The IDF does not get credit because the thousands of children it has murdered since 7 October do not amount to a proper proportion of the overall casualties it has caused.
Imagine if someone did math like this for the children that Hamas killed and 7 October and hopefully you’ll understand why this logic is a moral dead end.
@HeavenlyPossum Those comments were in response to others criticizing Israel for waging genocide while ignoring Hamas’ genocide. Those comments were in response to others claiming Israel was specifically targeting children when clearly they have not done so. It wasn’t a justification or defense of Israel as I’ve said many times before. If you only hear what you want to hear, then your brain is in danger of becoming an echo chamber.
As I have not now or ever ignored Hamas’ violence, I’m not sure how I was supposed to know that your comments to me were in response to something someone else said.
Israeli forces do, in fact, deliberately target civilians, including children, as a matter of explicit policy and as an inevitable byproduct of their preference for dropping bombs on crowded civilian infrastructure to target adversaries like Hamas.
@HeavenlyPossum Yes, to target Hamas adversaries. Hamas hides amongst civilians they claim to care about. That’s my point. If Israel really was intentionally targeting kids or wanted to completely eliminate all Palestinians they have the capability to do that. But they obviously are NOT doing that.
> “Yes, to target Hamas adversaries.”
No, sometimes specifically to kill Palestinian civilians. Maintaining the occupation requires constant violence.
> “Hamas hides amongst civilians they claim to care about.”
Yes, Hamas is monstrous in this regard, but this no more creates license for Israel to kill Palestinian civilians than the IDF’s use of human shields creates license for Hamas to kill Israeli civilians.
> “If Israel really was intentionally targeting kids or wanted to completely eliminate all Palestinians they have the capability to do that. But they obviously are NOT doing that.”
The failure of an actor X to murder all of group Y is not proof that actor X isn’t trying to kill some or all of group Y. The survival of the Jewish people is not somehow proof the Holocaust didn’t happen.