PhilippeOct 11, 2023
Jon Worth

Column in The Guardian about high speed rail in Spain https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/oct/11/spains-high-speed-trains-arent-just-efficient-they-have-transformed-peoples-lives?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

The penultimate paragraph is the crucial one - the network works if you’re going between cities. It doesn’t if you’re going to smaller places or don’t want to go via Madrid.

Spain’s high-speed trains aren’t just efficient, they have transformed people’s lives

A fiasco like HS2 could never happen here – our fast train network is so popular that no Spanish government would dare give up on it, says journalist María Ramírez

The Guardian
Oct 11, 2023 at 6:39amWeb
Show threadAmbroseOct 11, 2023
@jon If only there was a long thin country in Europe with a dense pre-existing conventional network and that country had still made a huge success of high speed rail. Then GB could compare itself to it. 🇮🇹
Show thread🇺🇦🇪🇺 cweickhmannOct 11, 2023
@ambrosen But how does that fit with 🇬🇧 exceptionalism? 🤔 @jon
Show threadDon ThompsonOct 11, 2023
@cweickhmann @ambrosen @jon
The exceptionalists don’t seem to have an issue with Ferrari, Lamborghini, Prada, Dolce & Gabbana, Gucci, etc.
🤷🏻‍♂️
Show threadStephen DrennanOct 11, 2023
@ambrosen @jon
The article even flatters the UK’s current HS line, when it quotes 68 miles. For travelling domestically, within the UK, the furthest you can go at high speed is Ashford (51 miles). The onward trains trundle to Folkestone, Dover etc go at a snail’s pace, only the Eurostar still uses a high speed line.
Show threadDave T-WOct 11, 2023

@ambrosen @jon

Also got Pennines/Appenines dividing that. Wondering if Italy has the equivalent of the M62...

Show thread🇺🇦🇪🇺 cweickhmannOct 11, 2023
@jon In that, such a system is the complement of bike infrastructure: It sort of works if you're going within a city, but you'll die if you want to go to another city ... or Madrid.
Show threadOliver SchönrockOct 11, 2023

@jon

yes, another country that only bullds radial. Just like the UK.

Show threadMans ROct 11, 2023
@jon At least Madrid is kind of in the middle. If the British rail lines converged on, say, Birmingham rather than London it might not be so bad.
Show threadbluGillOct 11, 2023
@jon Those are normal tradeoffs. If you are going to a small town it is always hard to serve you. Each stop slows down the train, and unless the small town is on the way between two larger cities it is just too expensive to provide HSR there. Spain should use their low construction costs to figure out if there is a way to make travel to small towns work, but it will involved travel through a big city (maybe Barcelona - or just pick a random elsewhere to have a bunch of radial lines meet at), and like several transfers in smaller towns. I don't see a HSR grid being affordable in a country, as nice as that would be, so there will always be many transfers to get to small towns or farms).
Show threadJon WorthOct 11, 2023
@bluGill You coordinate the arrival of regional trains with the departure of high speed trains in big cities. As Germany or Austria do, and Spain doesn’t. It isn't too complex.
Show threadbluGillOct 11, 2023
@jon Coordinating regional trains is a good step (or better yet run them frequent - I suspect Spain has the population to pull this off in at least some regions!), but you also need regional trains to somehow get everywhere, and be fast enough.
Show threadKo-Fan Chen 陳克帆Oct 12, 2023
@jon
That is why they are going to compete with Eurostar?👇
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/12/spanish-rail-firm-evolyn-planning-london-paris-service-rival-eurostar
Spanish rail firm planning London to Paris service to rival Eurostar

Evolyn says route is ‘strategic and high demand’ and it intends to launch its first service in 2025

The Guardian
Show threadJon WorthOct 12, 2023
@kofanchen Errr, no. This Evolyn firm is not one running in Spain currently. And this is why what they're proposing is a load of rubbish https://jonworth.eu/if-theres-to-be-a-rival-to-eurostar-through-the-channel-tunnel-its-not-going-to-be-mobico-with-new-trains-in-2025/
If there's to be a rival to Eurostar through the Channel Tunnel, it's not going to be Mobico (or Evolyn) with new trains in 2025 - Jon Worth

Update 12.10.2023 – this will not now be called Mobico, but a new brand called Evolyn but with the same backers – see Sky News and Railway Gazette. The Evolyn website is very sketchy. Alstom – the supposed manufacturer of the trains – has said nothing yet. So – honestly […]

Jon Worth
Show threadKo-Fan Chen 陳克帆Oct 12, 2023
@jon
Ah I see, thanks for correction🙏, putting a ? Now on the reply