@Strandjunker Tax everyone, why "the rich" ? The problem is that "the rich" is too vague, to ambiguous of a term, where do we set the threshold ?

Make it just, make it correct, so that everyone can get behind the idea !

Tax everyone, a just and fair percentage, and that way, nobody can complain they are taxed too much, or more than the next person. Only way to get everyone to agree !

@prolamerdude @potpie @Strandjunker

So Muskrat gets to pay the same tax as a immigrant labourer doing stoop work in fields? That is fair how?

There is no justification of any kind for any single person having a billion dollars of wealth.

Any out the top 20 riches men (its always men) in the world could use billions of dollars to, for example, end world poverty and still be insanely wealthy. They don't, they build penis space rockets, bigger and bigger yachts and ruin social media sites.

Its not taxation that's needed. Its appropriation of funds and assets. If billionaires wont use their money for good we take it from them.

@prolamerdude
why do you believe that Progressive Tax is bad?

It would only make sense if everyone paid the same percentage of taxes and also paid for everything at the same percentage of their wealth. For instance, imagine if those with lower incomes paid $1 for a burger, while billionaires paid half a million dollars for the same item. What do you think about that?

@tsungi @robcornelius @potpie @Strandjunker I don't think it's bad, but rather I cannot wrap my head around how it can be seen as fair. I'm still trying to figure this all out, I'm sorry if I maybe don't express my opinions too well yet.

In the example you gave, that would mean having more wealth poses absolutely no advantage. The idea of say, for example, my parents sacrificing going on vacation, in order to save for a better life later on, would mean nothing, because everything would [...]

@tsungi @robcornelius @potpie @Strandjunker [...] be more expensive afterwards, just because they saved money.

So what good would that do ?

The idea with taxes, in my view, is that we all have something to gain from a well-functioning society : infrastructure, education, healthcare etc. So we should all give back towards society, the same amount, percentage-wise. For me, it's like saying "Thanks to this society, I have earned this much, so I give a quarter/a third of my income [...]

@tsungi @robcornelius @potpie @Strandjunker [...] towards the betterment and the maintenance of this society".

This is how I see taxes, basically.

If a burger costs 10 times more when I have 10 times more savings, for example, I have absolutely no incentive to save money. Or to invest. Or to do anything else other than spend my money as soon as I get my salary.

That sounds very simplistic and would never work in a real, functioning society composed of normal people, at least I can't imagine

@prolamerdude
as you mentioned in another thread that everyone should contribute back to socieity. I would understand it as that everyone should also take responsibility for the common good (our environement or just burgers as example lol).
But what percentage of this responsibility for the common good should everyone bear? (It sounds somewhat akin to the concept of Individual CO2 credits.)

There are also a lot of concerns.
For instance, how do the wealthy tend to get even richer? Is it through hard work, or do they take advantage of those less fortunate and shift environmental problems elsewhere?
Why is it that someone with capital can generate even more wealth, while an average worker often has little to save after paying for rent and food?
Do you believe that "smart" individuals deserve to be rewarded with more wealth, even if many of them may do more harm than good to others (how about speculation on real estate? and poors get poor)
In your non-progressive tax idea, do you think there's a need for basic income or a minimum threshold?

maybe you have anwsers and I would be very interested in it.
Your idea sounds like someone who already possesses substantial wealth and keeps safeguarding their assets without knowing how poor the majority are. This situation is somewhat analogous to individuals in developed countries critiquing overpopulation in third-world countries and urging them to contribute /the same/ percentage of sacrifices to address climate change.

@tsungi I think this is one of the most interesting replies anyone gave me.

I cannot write messages that long (how did you do it?), so I'm going to write everything and break it down in multiple conséquent replies.

Firstly, a bit of background on me so that we can skip assumptions on a personal level : I come from Romania, our parents were low-middle-class, started from nothing, they both used to work two jobs when, I used to only see them at night around

[...]

@tsungi [...]

11pm or so when they got home, in order to save money in hopes of havin a better future.

We emigrated to France around 13 years ago, and as wedidn't have enough money, I used to look in bins for things people threw away that were still good. That's basically where I come from, I had some dark moments.

I worked during my studies (never had any government help, but that's because of myself, I didn't know that concept existed since it doesn't exist in Romania,

[...]

@tsungi [...]

so I never applyed for it), evenings and week-ends, finished 6 years of studies, with 2 bachelors and a Master's, and have been working on my own ever since I was old enough, basically. Have had a period of 10 years when I only saved and never went on vacation, because that's what my parents taught me, that's what they sacrificed their lives for, so that we could have a chance at a better life.

I'm writing all this, not for anyone

[...]

@tsungi [...]

to feel sorry for me or in the concept of "I had it hard so other people can do it too", but just so that I can explain to you that I'm not rich nor come from a rich family. I value hard work, saving, and living in a country where government is not corrupt all the way to its core and where if you work hard enough, you have a real chance to live a good life.

And regarding my current situation, I am currently in my thirties, I am probably lower middle class

[...]

@tsungi [...]

here in France, and have no urge to become rich; I only wish to live a tranquil life and to become self-sufficient, little by little.

I have a small amount of money put aside, and have been learning about how to best use that money in the future, how money works, how financial markets work, how to not fall in financial traps etc. I would love to be able to use that money for good in the future. So that's one of the reasons why I consider saving a good thing,

[...]

@tsungi [...]

and why I cannot comprehend people that talk about a "wealth tax", it seems so backwards to me...

So this is me.
Now, onto the points you made.

Yes, I agree that everyone should contribute back to society : anyone that earns even a single dollar, does so in part thanks to the fact that we have a functioning society (there are exceptions but let's say 99.9%) : simple example : if there was no infrastructure, absolutely nothing can

[...]

@tsungi [...]

function, no companies, no jobs, no nothing.

And I think, (again, in my very simplistic point of view) that the most fair way to express that contribution, would be a certain percentage of what you earn.

Now, that would not necessarily imply that "everyone should take responsibility for the common good", that is a different, more complex issue, at least in my view. What do you mean by the common good ? Who decides what that is ?

So that is absolutely not what I meant.

[...]