Mastodawn

pnutzh4x0r Sep 1, 2023

The technical merits of Wayland are mostly irrelevant

https://lemmy.ndlug.org/post/143136

The technical merits of Wayland are mostly irrelevant - NDLUG

In response to Wayland Breaks Your Bad Software [https://orowith2os.gitlab.io/posts/wayland-breaks-your-bad-software/] > I say that the technical merits are irrelevant because I don’t believe that they’re a major factor any more in most people moving or not moving to Wayland. > With only a slight amount of generalization, none of these people will be moved by Wayland’s technical merits. The energetic people who could be persuaded by technical merits to go through switching desktop environments or in some cases replacing hardware (or accepting limited features) have mostly moved to Wayland already. The people who remain on X are there either because they don’t want to rebuild their desktop environment, they don’t want to do without features and performance they currently have, or their Linux distribution doesn’t think their desktop should switch to Wayland yet.

FluffyPotato Sep 1, 2023

Yea, I’m currently using Wayland because Manjaro comes with it but like 90% of the programs I use launch with xwayland anyway. I’m not a developer but can’t they just give it proper support for all programs? Like run those programs like they do on X11. Seems pointless if nothing works on it.

Not to mention my laptop with Nvidia graphics, that is just so broken on Wayland I ended up switching it to X11 and I’m very lazy.

orangeboats Sep 1, 2023

Most programs you use (provided they are FOSS) probably already support Wayland, they just don’t do it by default. The following list of environment variables can go a long way in making your system largely Wayland-native.

GDK_BACKEND=wayland QT_QPA_PLATFORM=wayland MOZ_ENABLE_WAYLAND=1 #SDL_VIDEODRIVER=wayland # this one is dangerous if you play games

My desktop is basically just used for gaming so like nothing there is FOSS. My laptop is used for work which requires a ton of remoting so again Wayland would not work.

woelkchen Sep 2, 2023

My laptop is used for work which requires a ton of remoting so again Wayland would not work.

Funny how a 10 second “wayland remote desktop” web search disproves that claim.

FluffyPotato Sep 2, 2023

Last time I tried that it just launched through xwayland. And currently my laptop is using X11 because Nvidia GPU so I can’t re-test.

woelkchen Sep 2, 2023

And currently my laptop is using X11 because Nvidia GPU

All notebook released in the last several years with an NVidia dGPU also have an AMD or Intel iGPU.

FluffyPotato Sep 2, 2023

Sure and X11 actually works with it’s GPU while Wayland causes more issues than its worth. I’m not gonna use software that locks off my GPU especially if that software has no advantages for me.

woelkchen Sep 2, 2023

Wayland causes more issues than its worth. I’m not gonna use software that locks off my GPU

Sure, shift the blame of NVidia’s shitty Linux and Wayland support to Wayland. How on earth could a multi-billion dollar company ever manage to make proper drivers only 11 years after Wayland 1.0 has been released…? THAT’S IMPOSSIBLE! WAYLAND BAD!

FluffyPotato Sep 2, 2023

Never said that. It’s probably going to be better at some point but for the average user X11 is still a better option.

woelkchen Sep 2, 2023

for the average user X11 is still a better option

The average user has Intel/AMD iGPUs and uses whatever is default which in fact is Wayland in case of Gnome and Steam Deck Game Mode.

FluffyPotato Sep 2, 2023

Nope, steam deck is X11, just checked mine.

Yea, most people use the default, like I use Wayland on my desktop which is almost exclusively used for games so 99.9% of applications launch through xwayland. I’m saying Wayland doesn’t have advantages over X11 for the average user and for anyone with an Nvidia GPU it is an active hindrance.

woelkchen Sep 2, 2023

Nope, steam deck is X11, just checked mine.

Then you checked wrong and don’t understand the difference between Game Mode and Desktop Mode.

for anyone with an Nvidia GPU it is an active hindrance.

You bought an expensive product with incomplete drivers. The hindrance is NVidia.

GitHub - ValveSoftware/gamescope: SteamOS session compositing window manager

SteamOS session compositing window manager. Contribute to ValveSoftware/gamescope development by creating an account on GitHub.

GitHub

orangeboats Sep 3, 2023

On the other hand… if you are primarily gaming on your PC, then the moment Wine supports Wayland 90% of your programs will be Wayland-native.

FluffyPotato Sep 3, 2023

And that would be great if/when it happens but currently Wayland offers very little over X11 to the average user. Better multi monitor support is like the only thing.

orangeboats Sep 3, 2023

Theoretically an average user should feel nothing. The benefits of Wayland are usually more visible when more modern technologies are involved, for example VRR, high DPI, HDR, etc.