tst123ISPs complain that listing every fee is too hard, urge FCC to scrap new rule
AutoTL;DRThis is the best summary I could come up with:
Five lobby groups representing cable companies, fiber and DSL providers, and mobile operators have repeatedly urged the Federal Communications Commission to eliminate the requirement before new broadband labeling rules take effect.
The filing was submitted by NCTA-The Internet & Television Association, which represents Comcast, Charter, Cox, and other cable companies.
The trade groups met on Wednesday with the legal advisors to FCC Chairwoman Jessica Rosenworcel and Commissioner Brendan Carr, according to the filing.
The FCC rules aren’t in force yet because they are subject to a federal Office of Management and Budget (OMB) review under the US Paperwork Reduction Act.
The five trade groups complain that this would require ISPs “to display the pass-through of fees imposed by federal, state, or local government agencies on the consumer broadband label.”
ISPs could instead include all costs in their advertised rates to give potential customers a clearer idea of how much they would have to pay each month.
I’m a bot and I’m open source!
Why would anyone care what the ISPs think about how much work they have to do? We’re paying for it, so in what world is it not misleading to withhold information about charges?
Paperwork is the purview of the company, not the customer.
If it’s not too hard to charge the fees it’s not too hard to name them. Period.
Seriously. Don’t tread on me
Sounds like posturing to add a new fee for being required to list their fees if their weak argument gets thrown out by the FCC.
With ISP what is really need is Local-loop unbundling.
Those that are old enough to use DSL in early 2000, might remember there was a lot of ISPs to chose from. The reason for it was that due to Title II telco companies were required to lease lines to their competitors. We got Internet back to be categorized as Title II, but this specific rule was excluded and this is what would bring the competition.
theneverfoxSeriously. We’ve even pushed it onto cell providers, which has been great for consumers - yet we let ISPs push laws which make nonprofit community options illegal in many states
We’ve paid for their networks many times over at this point, and yet we still have some of the worst Internet in the developed world
AnonymousLlamaYeah that's the most brazen part. They're more than happy to pull in a dozen set of fees, but cry when they have to clearly list them so people aren't taken advantage of. This is the type of rubbish that the "free market" produces and why there needs to be some level of government oversight.
“Too hard to list our fees” = “consumers will see how hard we’re fucking them before they sign a contract”
It’s not like they have anywhere else to go 😬
MasterThis is where I am at. Got a phone survey from comcast. Gave them 1 star on every category except how likely am I to continue to use comcast at which point I gave them a 10… because it’s a monopoly and it’s literally the only ISP in my area. I pay 150 dollars for 10mb/5mb service with a 3tb cap. If I go two blocks in any direction I can get 100mb/50mb for 40 bucks with no data cap. Even the exact same plan from comcast 2 blocks away is half the price with 8 times the speed and no cap.
But because
DominusOfMegadeusCheck out if Verizon has 5G Hone Internet coverage in your area. It’s $35 a month if you have your phone plan with them, as well. (I do not work for Verizon)
Verizon and T-Mobile have home internet via cellular faster and cheaper than you’re getting.
Cameli_HostisIt sounds like providers are trying to hide monthly fees in an attempt to obscure them. My ISP will let me ‘rent’ a modem for $10 a month, but I just decided to buy my own for $60 fifteen years ago. My brain says that’s $1800 (it could be wrong, it’s late). If I didn’t know I was paying a $10 monthly fee, I’d never have bought my own.
And if a fee is actually a tax, just put that on the bill. It’s pretty simple.
You were only paying $10/mo. for your modem?? They were charging me $15/mo. for just the television remote! Fuck these companies, seriously (especially Comcast).
hoodatninja$10/mo = $120/yr.
15yr @ $120/yr = $1800
15yr @ $120/yr = $1800
Baby Shoggoth [she/her]The requirement that ISPs list all their monthly fees “would add unnecessary complexity and burdens to the label for consumers and providers and could result in some providers having to create many labels for any given plan,” the groups said in the filing on Friday.
It would put undo burden on you for them to tell you what they’re charging for. they’re trying to help you. this isn’t about capitalism, it’s about simplifying the process of them adding fees to your bill in a mutually beneficial way, because neither of you have to think too hard about where the fee money goes. it’s about mutual love, respect, and empathy 🙏
ParadoxMight wanna buy a new modem. 15 years ago was, what, DOCIS2? The new DOCIS4s could get you far faster internet
VlynDue to any technical/latency improvements?
Otherwise if they don’t pay for more bandwidth it wouldn’t actually get faster, right? If the current modem can already deliver the full speed they pay for?
A lot of ISPs have silently upgraded their bandwidth peaks, without telling customers, and use rented modem speed as a way of upselling. I.e. “We’ll double your speed for $15 a month”
Buying a new modem can end-run that and get you the speeds without changing your bill. When I had comcast in the Bay Area, buying a new modem gave me an extra 100mbit up and 30 down, without any interaction with comcast.
Oh, that’s weird, here in Austria you pay for x mbit down and y mbit up, that’s what you get. No matter your modem.
That’s how it’s supposed to work but a lot of techs just forget to set the limits or update the QoS tables and so your limits are more in the physical realm
Sort of like how in the 90s and 00s you could pop the filter off the line where it came into your house and get extra channels for free
Dem BosainCharter just increased my bill, and now for $5 more I can get a fiber connection from the city. So that’s what I’m doing. They will provide a new modem for free (technically free, I suppose). I’m lucky enough to live in a place where they’re municipal competition, even though Charter has fought it repeatedly.
The one I have is Docsis 3 (maybe 3.1?), but I have no idea how fiber modems are categorized. Maybe I should look into that 😬 .
It’s too hard to pay my bill too, so I’m gonna not do that.
Jeez if they cannot even identify what they’re charging for, then should they be charging for those things at all?
Sounds shady as fuck
krayjIf it’s too hard to disclose those costs up front, then how in TF are they able to figure it out down to the last cent on the first and subsequent bills?
Demonstrating that they have the ability to do it is not a very good argument for claiming it’s too hard.
SpezCanLigmaBallsI changed to T-Mobile internet for $30 with my phone plan. I couldn’t be any happier with my choice. Before I had xfinity for $30 and I had 75 down, 25 up, and 1tb data cap. With T-Mobile I get 300 down, 90 up, and no data cap for the same price. It’s perfectly good internet
If it is too hard, I'll be ok if they just skip it and won't charge it.
While we can assume there are others, Comcast in particular is a name you put to specifically trying to request for this.
gabe [he/him]The fact that ISPs in the US are not considered utilities and are regulated as such is baffling but kinda on brand
m-p{3}My ISP does it
Let me do it for you:
- O&M - $3
- R&D - $1
- Tech Support - $0.25
- CEO’s cocaine addiction - $25
- Selling your personal information & browsing history - ($10)
- Profits for Executive Bonuses - $50
- Stock Buybacks to Inflate Value - $25
Fake news–they would never give you a $10 discount for selling your personal information. That’s like taking food right out of those poor shareholders’ mouths!
It’s not a discount, it’s a surcharge
A number in parentheses means it is negative.
Huh, first time I’ve heard of it
I assumed it was a $10 service fee to pay for the infrastructure and staff who work hard to sell our personal information.
My formerly-favorite local pizza place got bought by a chain who put up 10+ TVs that show nothing but ads for the chain and occasionally portions of their menu (which is of course useless as a menu since it’s not visible most of the time). They also replaced the original simple but easy-to-use website with a gaudy infinite-scrolling pile of shit that makes you click through a bunch of “suggestions” just to order and pay for one fucking pizza.
Their pizza is still really good (for now, anyway) but they’ve now added a $2 “technology fee” to every order. Fuck corporate America so fucking hard.
circuitfarmerThat’s weird because they don’t seem to have an issue charging me for a bunch of weird little shit while also keeping close tabs on my usage.
Perhaps they could stop doing both and then it would free up time to innovate like we’ve given them public funds to do time and time again.
tallwookiealmost like they’re asking to be nationalized…
I’ll believe the US will nationalize a private industry when I see it and then I still won’t believe it.
The GOP would shit themselves
I see no downsides here
BappityI see it as an absolute win
Not technically “nationalized”, but we gave local and state governments control over sewers and water…
ToriborWell the internet is also a series of tubes so this logic plays out.
Around the latter half of the 19th century
…wikipedia.org/…/Water_privatization_in_the_Unite…
Unless they were in sole control of it.
They just need a hospital billing consult.
They got that shit down pat.
They got that shit down pat.
Why are “fees” above the advertised price? It’s just lying about the price of the service.
Billing charge: 4.99 Itemised bill charge: 10.99 Fee listing fee: 7.99
Issue with you bill? Call our hotline (calls charged @ 1.69/minute)
You missed out on an obvious joke, fee fee for your fee fees :p
Stoneykins [any]And they have the audacity to claim it is an issue of “making labels too confusing for consumers”.
They could always fold fees into the overall price, but that would be counterproductive to their real goal: lying about the price in advertising.
PyrExactly, if it is something that every customer has to pay no matter what, it’s not a fee it’s the cost of the service.
oh waaaaaaah cry about it >_>
kevinBLTISPs: “fine we will!” Q_Q
I can tell your age from the use of that emoticon. I think I like the fediverse.
Seems easy enough to charge all of them
What if we got really twisted and included tax and fees in the advertised price?