🇺🇦 Anna Filina
Why are JS frameworks so darn complicated? I can't even keep a mental model of a simple table with a few buttons. I need to add so much boilerplate code that I'd rather use jQuery. Either I'm missing something blindingly obvious about those frameworks, or they're just added complexity and weird patterns with marginal gains.
Aug 15, 2023 at 6:06pmWeb
Show threadOwen BeresfordAug 15, 2023

@afilina Some complexity is needed as JS has more weird corners than PHP3 does.
What version of JS/TS are you using (i.e. webrowser)?

I think the JS framework people like to prove how-much software engineering they are. (see enterprise comment by@[email protected])

Yes the RAM use is miserable in Electron

Show threadDerick RethansAug 15, 2023
@afilina Just use jquery :-)
Show thread🇺🇦 Anna FilinaAug 15, 2023
@derickr I would if it were my project. I still have a ton of sites and apps I built that run on jQuery without any bloat.
Show threadDaniel RotterAug 16, 2023
@afilina @derickr How exactly isn't jquery itself bloat?
Show thread🇺🇦 Anna FilinaAug 16, 2023
@danrot @derickr The jQuery slim build has a pretty small footprint.
Show threadDaniel RotterAug 16, 2023
@afilina @derickr the smallest number I found using google is 6kb, which is IMO quite a lot, considered it does not add a lot of value (if any) compared to modern JavaScript and its APIs.
Show thread🇺🇦 Anna FilinaAug 16, 2023
@danrot @derickr I suppose I'd need to revisit vanilla JS to see how it evolved. It may very well be that a lib is not even needed.
Show threadDaniel RotterAug 16, 2023
@afilina @derickr https://youmightnotneedjquery.com/ is a nice starting point for that 🙂
You Might Not Need jQuery

Examples of how to do common event, element, ajax and utility operations with plain javascript.

Show threadPaul ReinheimerAug 15, 2023

@afilina It feels to me like JS frameworks assume everything they touch is an enterprise application.

"So, you need two buttons, and a table with four cells that maintain state? Great. We're going to need a 7 step build process, a deploy process, a dedicated webserver, and four gigs of ram. Minimum."

Show threadMark SharpAug 15, 2023
@afilina trying to avoid js frameworks, just something else to maintain
Show threadTanguy ⧓ HerrmannAug 15, 2023
@afilina join us in the church of HTMX!
Show thread🇺🇦 Anna FilinaAug 15, 2023
@dolanor I'll take a look at it. Thanks for the suggestion.
Show thread🥧 asgrim 🇺🇦 Aug 15, 2023
@afilina what's wrong with using jQuery? Things like React, Angular, Vue, whatever I find so over complicated too!
Show threadMatthew Weier O'PhinneyAug 15, 2023
@asgrim @afilina Honestly, most of what jquery provided can be done easily in vanilla js anymore... Which is what I've started doing again, as who needs MBs of code for a simple fetch + inject into DOM operation...
Show thread🇺🇦 Anna FilinaAug 15, 2023

@asgrim I would choose jQuery over these bloated frameworks any day! I'm just stuck with Next.js legacy.

I remember coding a basic lib in jQuery so that values could stay in sync (elements would refresh themselves upon data mutations). My team built a very big interactive app on top of it that is now generating serious cash for the company.

This was when Angular 1 was still mostly unknown. Since then, it only went downhill. People underestimate how much *more* code they write with a framework.

Show threadOliver DrotbohmAug 16, 2023
@afilina If you are proficient in a server-side stack (no question, you are) then HTMX is a fresh breeze.