eldainThis community lately
EngywookIndeed. So boring and useless.
ThatWeirdGuy1001I guess because of the web environment integrity API proposed by Google. It enables your browser to tell the website it hasn’t installed AdBlock or any other undesired add on. This is marketed as improving security, but will mainly be used to block browsers which block adds.
HauiAnd big plus for google: it can be extended very well. The site sees any extension installed, if the browser is headless. So only google can use bots in the future and can rake in all the ai training profits and sell all the searchengine ads.
Wei is a lot more than ad block control.
theneverfoxIt’s not just open to Google and it doesn’t stop there either. Amazon could refuse to work if you’re on a phone and don’t have their app, or it could tell you to uninstall the Alibaba app before using
The possibilities are endless, and all benefits to be had are on the corporate side
I knew there‘d be some people with actual knowledge of the matter. Thanks for mentioning it.
I mean for some rare specific usages it could be usefull like ensuring bank webpages integrity or similar but mostly and the main usage would be for what you said.
It doesn’t though - it basically ensures your device settings.
Is that integrity? Maybe - if the attester code is flawless and handles all situations perfectly, it could theoretically add to integrity, but that’s not a realistic outcome
It’s not designed for that. It can only block the site - it doesn’t add to security, it takes away from it.
Say a bank designs their own attester - suddenly you have code that, if compromised, is always run in the most privileged execution context, in a way the user can’t control right before you enter your bank password
I don’t care what browser you use
Also I like Edge. It works great and Google can kiss my butt
Edge is based off chromium, same “engine” that powers Chrome. As most browsers are.
Yeah, it’s basically chrome without the bloat, less spying, and without the prohibition on ad blockers
That’s fine but the point of the post is that you have to use a non chromium browser to avoid wei. Once it’s implemented it’s likely that edge and others will have to implement it too.
No you don’t. Chrome might implement wei but chromium is open source. There’s literally no way they could force every chromium browser to use it and the threat of drm web isn’t affected by using a non wei chromium browser or Firefox.
It would be a monumental effort for smaller browsers to keep chromium extensions working, while the rest of the ecosystem moves to the new APIs. The only way that could work is if they all fork chromium and base their browsers on this new fork, and even then it’s not guaranteed to develop a real ecosystem of plugins since chrome has more users than all of those other chromium browsers combined.
So yeah you have to use Firefox if you want to avoid that, at least for now.
Thats what you get when you don’t care about single entities controlling the market.
What does the implementation with extensions look like? It’s a required module that every extension needs to handle?
How is there no way? Yes, there is. Google implements it in the original, websites start requiring it, all of those browsers that didn’t implement it will be denied from access to websites. The end.
And they do the same thing for Firefox
FeydaikinAre we talking about the same browser?
Edge has all of those things in spades.
macnielIt spies for someone else though
Yeah, great alternative /s
Not really.
Oh yes. Just because it’s for Microsoft doesn’t change Edges purpose.
Hell, it’s the foremost premise for every newer OS they’ve released, browser included.
There’s a reason Microsoft is just “giving upgrades away for free.”
Rage bait?
less spying
Don't need that if you make the OS.
If Google does push web DRM through, edge will surely adopt it. The best time to switch is now and there will no second best time if they actually do it.
As Chromium monopolizes the market they’re able to push anti-user updates because sites don’t care. It’s basically down to Firefox or Chromium-based browsers. Basically the only thing that’s kept Chrome from straight up removing adblocking capability and the like.
Correct. The real problem is allowing monopolies in the first place.
Lmfao. Bro edge is chromium my guy. You just switched from one skin to another is all. It’s all the same under the hood🤣
Yes. It’s chromium. It’s based on the open source base engine for Chrome. Which means, it has all the benefits of Chrome without the Google bullshit.
from the first sentence on the wikipedia page: Chromium is a free and open-source web browser project, mainly developed and maintained by Google.
Always amazing how much people can know without actually „getting it“. Just use firefox. You don’t get anything for „winning“ on a technicality. Just leave it be.
Why would I want to switch to Firefox? What I’ve got works great for me.
It ruins the internet. Google controls Chromium, if most browsers are Chromium-based, that means those browsers will eventually get whatever Google implements which means other browsers are forced to implement them or you can get broken websites.
It’s a fallacy. Why would I stop drinking alcohol, why would I stop smoking, why would I stop sunbathing without protection? Why would I leave the titanic? It is unsinkable. It works for you because you haven’t gotten to the bullet in the chamber yet.
The people here are trying to tell you that it’s not safe and that it will only get worse. And in opposition to your arguments, these facts are based on professional opinions and the known business practices of the companies these products are associated with.
I know you have your opinion but an opinion is not your personality. You can let go of it without ruining your life, again in opposition to keeping it and actually harming yourself, either financially or otherwise.
Why is it so hard to trust people who do this stuff for a living?
Really, dude? Using edge is like being a drunk? Lmao ok
I‘m glad you see that there are no good argument against privacy and keeping away from giant corporations.
Catweazle@Haui @Cleverdawny, I also use Chromium, Vivaldi since over 7 Years, not because Firefox or Otter Browser are bad, which I also have as second an third one, because of something called business ethics which has Vivaldi, because it fits best my needs, because it's faster than FF, because it's de-googled and don't have third party investors, because it's a European employees-owned Cooperative, it's a safe Browser with good privacy, products associated are Mastodon, Vivaldi mail, own userblog, sync
That sounds pretty awesome. I read about vivaldi pretty often. If the need pops up I will definitely check it out. Thanks :)
@Haui @Cleverdawny, the discrepancy between Chromium and Firefox users is absurd, if there is a common enemy that endangers the existence of both and all the other minority browsers, it is this that in the end ends up that only Chrome, EDGE and Opera exist anymore, because these have no qualms about including this Google Tokens shit.
It is a matter of thinking and acting together against this barbarism, something that Mozilla and Vivaldi are already doing, but more is needed.
It is a matter of thinking and acting together against this barbarism, something that Mozilla and Vivaldi are already doing, but more is needed.
Thanks. That is very kind of you to point out. Also, I don’t care about firefox at all. It was just the best I could find at the time and since am watching industry news if something not only marginally better pops up. Hasn‘t yet. As a sysadmin it is my job to keep systems running and ideally not vendor lock the company or myself. That’s why I stay away from google as much as I can.
@Haui, that is the problem, there are a lot of browsers, almost 100, out there, but there are only a few decent browsers.
There is Firefox and Vivaldi, maybe Otter, the three I currently have, but FF and Otther, because of test reasons, due to different engines they use..
Chrome, EDGE and Opera are Spyware, Brave not very trustworth because of shady relations with Cryptocompanies, a lot of other forks, some not so bad, but very weak in the market.
No much left.
There is Firefox and Vivaldi, maybe Otter, the three I currently have, but FF and Otther, because of test reasons, due to different engines they use..
Chrome, EDGE and Opera are Spyware, Brave not very trustworth because of shady relations with Cryptocompanies, a lot of other forks, some not so bad, but very weak in the market.
No much left.
I agree. The reason for this is market control imo. Chrome is default on chromeos, edge on windows and they’re doing everything they can to make it hard to integrate with other things.
Actually, it should be outlawed to even install a browser and definitely to recommend one.
@Haui, what should be declared illegal is that a private company dominates an essential public space such as the Internet today.Everyone uses the browser that suits them, as a basic tool to access this space. Those who want to protect privacy, avoid using those of these private companies like Google, Microsoft or this Chinese thing.
Open the rest of the text in a new tab
https://file.coffee/u/5tHJjZEmLvw7f_g4P_99U.pdf
Absolutely. I agree. There should be a tool to select browsers on every os but none preinstalled.
The description must come from the makers and sorting can only be done on alphabetical order, last update and number of downloads maybe.
Have a good one.
@Haui, Windows always had an app to download a browser, now it's called EDGE I think.
Well, you could see it like that I guess. :D
But honestly, an app that just shows a repo of browsers (which were virus tested) and downloads one but can itself not be used as a browser should be mandatory for every OS and done.
@Haui, it's the same, a repo to download a browser IS a browser, at least it's engine. Because of this it's irrelevant if there is a preinstalled browser or a repo dedicated. Also eg the Steam client is a Chromium (bad optimized, slow as hell, in Kiosk mode)
Apart what will you do, if you want a browser which isn't in this repo?
I think it's easier if the OS include a Browser and everyone is free to use it or use it to download a browser to his like from its official homepage.
Apart what will you do, if you want a browser which isn't in this repo?
I think it's easier if the OS include a Browser and everyone is free to use it or use it to download a browser to his like from its official homepage.
First of all, thanks but I‘m familiar with sysadmin stuff and a (web) browser is not the same as a repo.
I‘m talking about something like the appstore that you now have on most OSs. It needs to be open so no single corporation can control it. And it needs to be the same on all OSs for this browser issue (although one could argue it should be the same for everything).
And no, I‘m not talking about things that are just not available for windows/linux/macos but aside from that, the ui, sorting should be similar.
That way you make it impossible for MS to push edge, for linux to push firefox and for google to push chrome.
You visit the appstore and install your browser, then you can go online.
@Haui, ok but i still see the advantage there can be
How does a repository keep up to date with the 1000 or so existing browsers? Where is it downloaded from and what advantages does it offer compared to downloading it from its official website?
In Android there is the Play Store with dubious security and with many apps retouched and cutted off by Google, eg the app Blokada isn't the same as Blokada from F-Store or the original .apk in the Website. In Windows I avoid the Store for same reasons
How does a repository keep up to date with the 1000 or so existing browsers? Where is it downloaded from and what advantages does it offer compared to downloading it from its official website?
In Android there is the Play Store with dubious security and with many apps retouched and cutted off by Google, eg the app Blokada isn't the same as Blokada from F-Store or the original .apk in the Website. In Windows I avoid the Store for same reasons
As I already answered to you in another comment: there needs to be a law that specifies how this store/list is made, what it contains and how it is displayed. It has been done thousands of times. Trust me, it’s gonna work.
@Haui, You cannot prevent an OS from modifying a Store according to its own interests, with which we arrive at the same thing that could only accept a list with links that point to the corresponding official pages of the browsers for download, an online activity that requires an engine for defect that is the same as that of the usual browser used, as in the example of the Steam client, in essence a Chromium in Kiosk mode.
I don’t have the faintest idea where you have your info from but you can make an OS do whatever you wan‘t. As a programmer, it’s dead easy to make something appear a certain way, display certain things in a certain order.
You write a law that says (I‘m not a lawyer, bear with me): every OS that has a GUI must display a „get browser“ shortcut on the desktop/main screen after installation. This shortcut needs to open a store (similar windows/linux/macos/iOS stores) which displays all browsers in this open list [source] only sortable by name, newest update, ratings. No other markings, highlights or recommendations are allowed.
That then needs to be sharpened a little bit since there might be ways around it in this form. Then you have your problem solved.
Have a nice day.
@Haui, not a problem in Linux, but I'm not sure about the trust in MS and Google. Which Lawyer will impose this law? The same old people who confuse a remote control with a mobile in the parties paid by these multinationals? Wait for it.
In theory it's a nice idea, but this remains heavenly music in practice.
M$ has no qualms about offering FOSS in its store by setting a price, like some time ago with LibreOffice for €9.90.
In theory it's a nice idea, but this remains heavenly music in practice.
M$ has no qualms about offering FOSS in its store by setting a price, like some time ago with LibreOffice for €9.90.
Yes, you are correct. The political side will be a nightmare.
But this has historically always been the case. We need to agree on something and get more people go agree on it and so on. It’s actually doable, it’s just out of the scope for most people since they don’t have concise thoughts to begin with.
Chromium is not free of Google’s bullshit. Chromium development is under direct control of Google.
These are not conclusions based on the other half, these are distinct facts. Also, if not for this, why would a chromium fork named “ungoogled chromium” exist?
It does have a nice pdf reader