DanteriousMore Perfect Union went to a trump rally. Their criticisms sound very close to that of socialists
It’s so hard to watch people speak their values and beliefs and then promptly vote against them because of feelings based propaganda.
If they were to vote for their values who would they vote for?
The democrats aren’t upholding these values either and while I agree that they are much better than the current republican party it doesn’t mean that voting for them would be voting in their interest but instead in the least bad option.
Uriel238 [all pronouns]We vote blue not to change the system but because voting red makes the situation worse. The whole affair with the GOP stacking SCOTUS with Federalist Society jurists provides one example of many. At this time, they’re trying to neuter elections to push Democrats out entirely.
To change society we’ll have to do far more than merely vote. And to date, we’ve had to claw every right we have by force or coercion, and when the public isn’t a direct threat to the elite, they feel free to strip away our rights. Dobbs was only the most public of the provisions: most fourth- and fifth-amendment protections have been stripped away, again by the US Supreme Court.
All that I am saying is that I think we are way past the time were voting is the most important thing we should be doing to make the situation better. People in power are going to make whatever they want illegal and use political justifications for them. There have been many states that have majority blue and majority red power and this same shit of empowering the status quo is common in both kinds of states. So I don’t believe either party is going to protect my rights if it doesn’t benefit them somehow and instead I am going to trust in the direct actions I and people that want change are actually taking to make things better.
Can you show me a single peice of Republican sourced legislation that aimed to improve the average Americans situation? Also for a bonus round feel free to justify how bathroom bans and creating a trans panic help the average American since it’s a major priority of the Republican party. Both sides are the same if you are a gullible dunce, sure…
My experience with “both sides are bad” type people is that they don’t typically think too hard on the reality of the nonsense they drivel and instead assume it must be that way because it’s what they’ve heard. How about giving us even a single example of democrats attempting to invalidate broad swaths of votes to disenfranchise republican voters like Republicans do. Or even trying to pass legislation to overturn vote results they don’t like, like Republicans have done in several instances since 2021. Can’t let the people decide what’s in their interest, they might not vote “right”.
Hell that and propaganda are pretty much the reason the party is alive, what with if being filled to thee brim with traitors and seditionists that continue to lie and obfuscate their parties coupt attempt. Oh yeah how many times have Democrat’s tried to steal the head of our democracy? I know two off the top, January 6th where they weren’t successful and the 2000 election where the Supreme Court overstepped their bounds after Republicans staged the brooks Brothers riot and handed GW the win despite margins being razor thin, far closer than trumps loss in 2020. Maybe look at the players there, you will probably see some overlap in the enablers and perpetrators of the J6 coupt attempt. Who is Roger Stone, right?
In any case if you’re going to pretend to care about the average American, if there’s any legitimate interest there, maybe take the time to know you’re not just making things worse yourself. At this point a vote for Republicans is a vote against the interest of the average American. If you think otherwise feel free to give examples.
SchmooCome on, you’ve built a massive strawman going on very little. I agree with a lot of what you are saying, but the position you’re attacking is clearly not the position the person you’re replying to intended to express.
It bothers me that you’re being heavily downvoted for saying that direct action is more effective/important than voting, so I’m chiming in to say I agree with you.
This isn’t an ‘enlightened centrist’ position here, just a realistic one. I will continue to vote Democrat and encourage others to do the same, but I don’t have any illusions that doing so is anything more than damage control.
Our political system in the US is corrupt, not just the people within it. Changing it will require external support.
Nah, changing it will just require a guillotine and a lot of angry people.
No, it won’t really, because all you would be doing is removing the corrupt people from power without changing or replacing the corrupt system in which they operated.
Systemic change happens on 2 fronts, both internal and external.
direct action is more effective/important than voting
The important, crucially important part here that there is no either/or scenario. Voting is action, and if you do everything else but not vote, that everything else gets kinda pointless. At least for now, in couple of voting cycles GOP will complete their plan to destroy the democracy, and then the voters apathy will be self-fulfilling prophecy. But for now it’s not there yet.
If you look at what the administration is actually doing and trying to do, there is a lot of going to the right direction. There is absolutely not enough of that, they probably could and definitely should do more, but it’s disingenuous to say that they do absolutely nothing for the working class.