OiconomiaThere's more reasons to feel old than just old memes
ZILtoid1991That was peak aesthetics.
Was?
You too stray far from the light.
You too stray far from the light.
Flaky_Fish69But we like the dark.
Darkness, for dark deeds.
Darkness, for dark deeds.
ššŖš³š¬BY FAR!
We're all still emo/scene kids at heart, it was never a phase mom
Manuhabe [email protected] nicht umsonst gegrĆ¼ndet!
I still cry listening to Bright Eyes.
I donāt care what anyone says though. No one can write like Conor Oberst.
Preach. If I could be any age forever it would probably be one of the ones from my days as a scene kid.
JackbyDevRawr xD
Gotta express my uniqueness by dressing like everyone else
To be fair: The scene was much smaller back then and many emo kids were basically scorned and beaten for the emo aesthetic.
I would still happily rock an Invader Zim shirt in 2023
Apathy TreeI have one, and do. Itās gir and says free hugs.
The Millenials laughing at Gen Z are the same Millenials who mocked emo/scene kids back then.
naevaTheRatWas a goth, mocked emos and scene kids. Learned my lesson, rock on you little weirdos, enjoy your time of experimentation
Goths mocking emos always made me laugh. Which is itself a third layer of comedy because I was supposedly an old school punk but really just another kid with a funny 'do (green mohawkā¦which I still hold as the most righteous hairstyle known to man, however)
I mocked all of you. Jokes on me you all turned out pretty cool and to have good taste in music. I was just uncomfortable experimenting and possibly coming off ridiculous. Somehow I managed to be cringe because of my efforts not to.
cringe finds us all. Our curse was out fear of it, our blessing is we can free future generations with our knowledge.
Thereās no escaping regret, so lets all just celebrate ourselves and understand others are doing the same.
to my hormone soaked brain being disaffected and into the grotesque was infinitely cooler than being disaffected and sad.
We enjoyed punks though, there was this group of kids thatād meet up in the city and weād be punks, metalheads, and goths all confident in our superiority to emos who we called posers.
Those complaining ones are boomer converts. I see more of them in retro game groups.
Yeah I donāt get it. Do they not see the irony?
Just let the next generation be the next generation.
Emo/Skater outfit makes everyone over 9000% more attractive.
ObiHelps that the style āhidesā a lot, hard to tell what she really looks like under the makeup, loose clothing and accessories.
We stumbled so you could also stumble but down some stairs.
Sometimes I think that since I still really love goth chicks I havenāt changed that much since the 00s
But then I remember that over that time frame goth chicks went from edgy rebellious teenagers in a ton of makeup to moms in their 30s with a wicked sense of humor that wear a lot of black. They still deal weed and hate authorities though.
DessertStormsWatching my once fully goth and punk friends raise kids is odd but also wonderful, knowing that they're passing their zero tolerance for societies' bullshit on to their kids (as best they can, considering what we're up against) is heart warming.
Wouldn't want to do it myself though lol
Wouldn't want to do it myself though lol
God, I miss that time. Closest you get to that aesthetics nowadays still is some forms of visual kei (stuff like lynch.), but itās a different vibe.
I Must Be Emo by Hollywood Undead lyrics
Oh man, that brings back memories
Iāve got paint on my nails and makeup on my face
Iām almost emo enough to start shaving my legs
Have you heard about the emo pizza? It cuts itself!
Gen X: Haha, those millenials sure looked stupid as kids!
Also Gen X:
Give them a break, they had no other accepted way to explore their sexuality
/s but also no /s
Yeah thatās just facts. This Bowie type shit is ANYTHING BUT straight, thatās what makes it iconic.
The straights have always copied/been inspired by queer fashion, just like white america with black american music genres (jazz, rock, blues, r&b, rap).
The straights have always copied/been inspired by queer fashion, just like white america with black american music genres (jazz, rock, blues, r&b, rap).
Absolutely, thereās a long history of the āin-groupā co-opting culture from the āout-groupā because itās exotic and ātransgressive.ā Was it hypocritical for such a homophobic generation to idolize queer icons, only so long as they were cool and made good music? In a generational sense, yeah. On an individual level, depends on the individual and their specific beliefs and actions
Bowie, Freddy Mercury, Elton John, etc were just so damn cool they overpowered any homophobia
livusAw man, I clicked that thinking it was going to be Grunge or even this sort of thing.
I always forget that gen x also includes people way older than me.
Seriously thatās some 80s shit my sister was into but sheās 9 years older than me, meanwhile it was more Biggie and Wu-Tang for me when they dropped around 93-94 when I was a teen. It was all baggy clothes.
Starter jackets, timbs, raidersā¦ Fubuā¦ Billabongā¦ Wallet chains. The longer the wallet chain the more dominace you had over peers.
It all started with a Starter Coatā¦ www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1Kc8GVUBRI
Royce da 5'9 - Starter Coat (Layers)
And these are the ones scared of gender/LGBTQ politicsā¦ We know why nowā¦
Is... is that the rep we have? Gen X was also sex positive feminism 3rd wave and the beginning of intersectionalism.
Guess it depends on where you live. I find a lot of people around me that are 45 and up and donāt live in a more wealthy area are basically that way.
Yikes that sounds rough!
We have had problems over here where we lose people down an antivax q-anon abbit hole, but it seems to affect all ages. I think maybe it has something to do with underlying mental health vulnerabilities.
I donāt think it is about flipping a coin between open-minded and close-minded but about radicalization. While it is harder to see with QAnon, radicalization be it right, left (although you have to go really far on the horseshoe), or religious is staunchly anti-intellectualistic. Once you believe in ideas or at least do not see them as really distasteful, it gets easier to go towards more and more batshit insane ideas.
While I am not sure if there is actual research on how age affects radicalization, research on radicalization has identified certain things that make it likelier for a person to be radicalized. Vulnerability, marginalization, and othering are all pretty common. To extend it there might be an age group vulnerability of 45 and up age group because of either being empty nesters or kids at least starting to be a lot more independent.
There is also somewhat of a domino effect. People like to be part of a group. If people donāt give any legitimacy to radicalized viewpoints, it makes it harder to be radicalized. The problem with this is also how hidden ideas can become mainstream as has at least in Western countries happened with the alt-right, they can reach a scary critical mass. Once you have been tempered with completely crazy viewpoints at one point thinking JFK Jr will be resurrected is not that weird anymore.
Over a decade ago when I started to get really worried about the rise of fascism in the West, my mom thought I was insane. Now we have had (not American) actual neo-Nazi as minister and no one of the ministerial parties thought it was a huge enough deal to actually not do it. In my books that means they all are neo-Nazies. My mom also doesnāt think I am insane anymore. The tools they used to gain power are not new. We are just not taught to identify them. I was because it would be a pretty bad idea to have someone in my profession if not aware of signs of radicalization.
Even education can only do so much to make up for a complete lack of cognitive ability.
Even education can only do so much to make up for a complete lack of cognitive ability.
Even education can only do so much to make up for a complete lack of cognitive ability.
Even education can only do so much to make up for a complete lack of cognitive ability.
Even education can only do so much to make up for a complete lack of cognitive ability.
We really need to step out of the idea that radicalization only happens to people who are somehow slow or uneducated. It might make you more likely to fall for it, but cognitive ability and education will not mean you will not end up there as well. Issue with the anti-intellectualism of the alt-right is not if someone themselves has education but if they are willing to listen to other people who do. If no one is an expert for example racist ideas of the alt-right about biological differences canāt be refuted. Which is probably partially where it comes from times quite a lot.
Everyone likes to think they have cognitive ability. If we just think radicalization happens only to stupid people, and you are not stupid, getting a person de-radicalized is going to be a lot harder. Thinking that we as people with cognitive ability canāt be radicalized will also make it easier to fall for it because you canāt be radicalized.
Instead of intelligence or education, we should focus on the trifecta of vulnerability, marginalization, and othering. Thatās a better predictor.
(And no, I do not actually disagree about the ideas being idiocy, just that falling for them are not just for idiots)
I disagree on the fundamental level that if someone āintelligentā chooses to follow the ideas of idiocy itās not proof that the intelligent can be swayed, but that the individual is objectively less intelligent that previously assumed.
Really, this is a great example as to why āintelligenceā and ā`wisdomā are two entirely separate things.
It is because radicalization is more than a cognitive process. It is as much social and psychological. Intelligence alone is a pretty bad predictor of a lot of things we like to think only depend on intelligence. While there is some causation, it is not a vacuum or often even the biggest predictor of many things.
Radicalization is the thing that makes you believe in things that canāt be real. Making people believe a lot of things is surprisingly easy. Look into religions. While I donāt believe and you might not, a lot of intelligent people throughout world history have. There might be a correlation between intelligence and atheism these days, but the effect is far from linear.
I would then argue that youāre disassociating emotional intelligence with total intelligence. If someone is emotionally unintelligent enough to be swayed by rhetoric then they arenāt an intelligent person being manipulated they are an emotionally compromised person being manipulated.
They definitely are emotionally compromised person being manipulated but being emotionally unintelligent and being emotionally compromised are not the same thing. While being emotionally unintelligent will affect your risk of being radicalized it does so through your own emotions and capacity to process them in a healthy way.
Radicalization happens in steps. You donāt get from being blind to racism and as the next step participating in genocide. Nor do you go from wondering if you are being lied to for some nefarious reason to believing 5G will kill you. It is a slow and gradual process. A lot of people are following the same playbook. It includes things like moving goalposts, giving the same legitimacy to two viewpoints that are not equal in ethics or evidence, playing on fear and discomfort, and giving convenient fall guy for peopleās difficulties. In my language, there is a saying that in a group stupidity condenses. That isnāt because peopleās intelligence somehow lessens but because of the social nature of human beings.
It is not like people in Nazi Germany suddenly lose their collective cognitive or emotional intelligence in 20s and 30s. There were pretty clear issues going on that could be seized for populist politics. It is also not like Nazis themselves didnāt have a huge amount of anti-intellectual pseudoscience in their idealogy and, in the case of some members, a lot of occultism going around.
The hard truth is that people in general are really bad at seeing manipulation. You can see the clumsy attempts but the majority of people judge othersā actions based on their view of their intentions. And as in general we would like to think of ourselves as well-intentioned, we are not judging if someone is manipulating all the time. Critical thinking can help but the thing about radicalization is that it speaks to multiple psychological tendencies we naturally have.
And while I deem QAnon shit and even any flavor of alt-right or religious fundamentalism idiocy, the pure fact that they have been as successful as they have tells that their manipulation is quite finessed.
Stupid is as stupid does.
Da packages.
I think back then you could do āgayā things without being seen as gay so it was okay.
It was okay to dress like that if everyone knew you were out smashing loads of chicks.
But not people are going to think youāre gay so itās really different.