Steve EasterbrookI'd like to live in the world where the pedestrian lights are green by default, and the drivers have to press a button and wait ages for the lights to change.
Dr Grace Peng@steve they need to exit their car, cross a turn lane, mount the sidewalk, push the beg button, then run back to their car before the light turns
almeida_alvaro
Iñaki Calvo 🇪🇺@steve that'd be awesome.
Ben Clifford@steve there's a slight precedent in railway signalling safety, I think I read about: something like, all lights should be at red always unless you're expecting a specific train to need to pass...
Dan@benc @steve as a railway signalling engineer I can partly confirm this...
Under the UK system anyway....
Signals that read across junctions are generally at red unless a route has been set for a particular expected train
Signals that only prevent a train from colliding with the train in front generally operate fully automatically and show green while the track ahead is clear
420@steve Some traffic lights have pressure zones… they turn green when a car stops on them. http://archive.boston.com/cars/news/articles/2010/05/09/the_sensitive_science_behind_and_beneath_traffic_lights/
Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
Sean@toriver @420 @steve here in Australia we have electromagnetic loops in the road at intersections. So you stop your motorcycle where it covers the most length of loop ... and hope the loop is sensitive enough. I've sat through 3 cycles of lights (with zero other traffic) at night, at one particular intersection.
We also have plenty of buttons on cycle paths that are metres away from where you actually cross the road.
.... and some buttons that don't do anything during peak hours (when changes are timed), but youre not told that.
Maddogeco@SeanHawley @toriver @420 @steve that’s me on my bicycle every day either waiting for a car or risking a fine to push the beg button or run the red light.
Antonio J. Delgado❤️🧡💛💚💙💜@steve unfortunately it probably generate more CO2 to stop and start combustion engines, but I agree that cities should be thought for people and not cars
Pare 
🚲 🌞
Rivoluzione mobilità urbana🚶🚲🚋 (@[email protected])
Allegato: 1 immagine Non vedo perché non dovrebbe essere così in ambiente #urbano. Penso che chi mette in pericolo gli altri non dovrebbe avere la priorità. #violenzastradale #cittadellepersone
Bèr Kessels 🐝 🚐 🏄 🌱@steve in the Netherlands modern traffic lights are designed so they give preference to the "most people being able to move". It's rather pragmatic.
Sometimes that's smart schema's, adapting over time, or with cameras and all. But quite often it's simply preference for one stream over the others. E.g. bike lanesc lights being green by default. Or keeping pedestrian crossings green and only interrupt that when multiple cars need to cross. Etc.
Irina
Markus Sagebiel msgbi
Mika@steve I'd prefer cars and pedestrians not crossing each other. Alternative routes and car free city centres (where possible).
yaygya
Pitz@steve This already exists, but only if you ride a motorcycle!
Tirial@steve My favourite thing about old cities with historic centres is that most of them are banning motor vehicle traffic. It is, absolute bliss.
Gregg Alley@steve We have a “scramble intersection” on a recently opened bike path that crosses the intersection diagonally. When activated by a cyclist or pedestrian, all vehicular traffic stops.
Bettina HartmannI had to look up "scramble intersection" - living in Denmark, which is otherwise very pedestrian- and bicycle-friendly, this is one thing I don't think I have seen here :-) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedestrian_scramble
Anke@steve I'd accept a version with sensors instead of buttons, so they only have to position the car correctly
@steve this is one of my favorite pet peeves.
hoya@steve I don't think it's such a great idea. Cars stopping and then accelerating because of this will produce additional brake and tire dust, tailpipe emissions and use more energy. It could sort of work with regen and EVs, perhaps, but I would much rather focus on cities with less cars and less places pedestrians have to cross a road used by vehicles. Surprised to see @helenczerski boosting this.
Beeks@steve no you wouldn't. Don't pretend you didn't learn over the last 3 damn years what a supply chain is.
@helenczerski
@helenczerski
ChrisM@steve I think in residential areas it should be a default for the municipalities to install speedbumps instead of stop lines, so that stop signs can be taken seriously.
Jeremy Kitchen@steve @TicklishHoneyBee and in order to make a left turn they have to do it twice!
@steve @TicklishHoneyBee or I suppose a right turn if you’re in one of THOSE countries… :)
𝖄𝖔𝖚𝖗 𝕲𝖔𝖉 𝕷𝖚𝖈𝖎𝖋𝖊𝖗 👻@steve
Where I live people would just get tired of waiting and try to run you over anyways (I've had people almost run me over at red lights and stop signs)
Where I live people would just get tired of waiting and try to run you over anyways (I've had people almost run me over at red lights and stop signs)
Jan Penfrat
Adrian Morales@steve I am so stealing this!
adamrice@steve In the USA, the majority of those beg buttons don’t do anything—they’re placebos.
Parade du Grotesque 💀Don't we all?
Rob Bos@steve
Bonus points for having to lean awkwardly over a curb or for having to physically leave the vehicle and walk a few seconds to hit the button like I often have to do on a bike.
Bonus points for having to lean awkwardly over a curb or for having to physically leave the vehicle and walk a few seconds to hit the button like I often have to do on a bike.
Rebel 🏳️🌈@steve there’s a traffic light around here that’s absolutely maddening. It’s a 30kph zone, where the city is making it purposefully unattractive for cars - the idea is that you only drive in here if you absolutely need to. That’s actually working, so there aren’t many cars. Still, the pedestrian light is red for ages, with no car traffic at all. Of course then everyone crosses on the red light, until suddenly a car does come around the corner and you have to run. Mad!
Aviva Gary
Bytebro 🇬🇧 🇺🇦 🇬🇱@steve A similar suggestion[1] was made (I believe - could be wrong, but I read it online so it must be real, right?) in the UK and was dismissed as it might 'increase traffic congestion'. Doh!
1. I believe the main difference was that the driver(s) would not be pushing buttons, simply triggering the automatic sensors that 'tell' the junction that a vehicle is waiting or approaching. Pedestrians would have priority at all other times.
CubeOfCheese@steve bad crosswalks are the bane of my existence
Martijn VosWhen I was a teenager, I rode 10km to school, half of which was next to a highway.through the polder. There was one intersection with a small polder road where the cars on the highway always had green, unless there was a car on the polder road, in which case it would briefly turn red. The bike path next to the highway, however, always had red. I'd stop, press the button, it would immediately turn green, and I could continue.
I'd rather not stop. It was clearly safe. The highway had green, I could tell there were no cars turning right onto the polder road, so I'd just run the red light. Until one day, there was a police car hidden behind the bus stop. Specifically to fine all the cyclists that had figured out it was safe to run the red light at that intersection.
md4nt@steve thank you
Thorsten Behrens@steve you should come & visit #hamburg / germany then. two of those default-green-for-bikes traffic lights on my way to work:
https://www.adfc.de/neuigkeit/ampelschaltungen-in-hamburg-autos-muessen-jetzt-betteln
GuacamOlé 🥑
Kevin P. Fleming@steve There is an intersection in our little town that has a '30 second walk timer' in every single light cycle. It does not have to be requested, and the crosswalk signs show the countdown.
The drivers who have to wait for it, after expecting THEIR light to turn green, get really annoyed.
⁂ Fish Id Wardrobe@steve In NZ (?) they are trialling a system where traffic lights are red by default but turn green if a car approaches them at below the speed limit.
Mark@fishidwardrobe @steve If the lights turn green before the cars need to slow down I don't see a problem.
However if a car is required to slow or stop, it's a waste of energy and increases pollution.
@fishidwardrobe @steve Fish ID:
The slowing down was not related to level crossings.
The slowing down was referring to an what sounded like a experiment where traffic signals rest on Red only changing to Green when an approaching car/truck/bus is detected.
@paka
Wait, so your argument is that having built our towns and cities around the least efficient and most polluting form of transport we should now do everything we can to avoid them having to slow down because that wastes energy and increases pollution???
🤣 🤣 🤣
Wait, so your argument is that having built our towns and cities around the least efficient and most polluting form of transport we should now do everything we can to avoid them having to slow down because that wastes energy and increases pollution???
🤣 🤣 🤣
@steve No Steve. I'm suggesting causing an increase in fossil fuel use and increasing pollution should be avoided.
Patrick Lam 
@fishidwardrobe @steve I think you're talking about the pilot project in Brossard Quebec. https://jalopnik.com/city-tests-traffic-light-that-only-turns-green-for-driv-1850419759
Rob McKenna@steve even if it automatically detected. Down the road for me there is a priority intersection, the induction loop will detect a car coming to the junction and the light go green 4 seconds after you stop unless there are a stream of cars the other way in which case it will be a few more seconds. Pedestrians have to walk up to the begging button and wait for a minute and a half if there is any traffic at all.
DoctorOctothorp@steve That's if the car beg button works at all.