Qagggy 
2008 v. 2023: I don’t think people realize the extent to which parked cars degrade public space.
Andres@qag It's funny because if you showed most people pictures of front lawns (or back yards) with with cars up on blocks, they'd be like "omg eyesore" but if you show them a typical american street with cars parallel-parked on it, they'd be like "oh that's normal"
@Andres4NY Cars ruin everything. Most notably our brains.
EvilGinger- Queen of Naps@qag @Andres4NY
As a disabled person who sometimes needs to use a wheelchair to get around- no car means I can't get anywhere with steep hills, or miles from my home. I can't ride a bike, or walk long distances with my cane on good days- I need a car to get to the store or the doctor's office or to a concert or gathering.
I do agree that there are far too many cars and trucks and even motorcycles on many of our roads. But some of us do *need* them to be able to get to necessary services and resources. My doc isn't going to send someone to push me 10 miles to her office and then home again. But good sidewalks and bicycle/wheelchair/scooter spaces are needed, and fewer cars and trucks on the roads overall.
SomeAnoTooter@EvilGinger013 @qag @Andres4NY are you sure you need a car for that? You yourself talked about using a wheelchair. That's not a car. Yes you need a vehicle, but it doesn't need a big wide street that is for fast moving SUVs, especially in towns. No majority wants a future without cars (maybe only in a utopia where trains and buses travel everywhere), but we can all be satisfied without big streets for big cars in our towns. There certainly are already vehicles that can get along in bikelanes.
@SomeAnoTooter @qag @Andres4NY Did you read what I wrote at all?
Yes- I need a car to get to places miles away from my home, whether I am in my wheelchair or using my cane. I do not have a motorized wheelchair- those things are expensive as all get out- expensive to buy, expensive to repair. I can't push myself 10 miles down a highway to get to my doctors' suburban or city offices. I can't park 2 miles away and push myself or walk up steep hills to get there either.
But I also said "But good sidewalks and bicycle/wheelchair/scooter spaces are needed, and fewer cars and trucks on the roads overall.". If the spaces I need to get to have good sidewalks and bike/wheelchair paths on relatively level ground- I am all for it and will use them. But if these common areas become crowded with market stalls, tables and chairs, and crowded people- my wheelchair and lack of ability to move quickly and agilely means- I do not get to share them at all. Pretty places for you, but if I have mobility issues- I stay home?
@SomeAnoTooter @qag @Andres4NY Some of the spaces i have seen look fantastic- if you are not mobility-challenged. Spaces with wide stairways leading to sitting areas- but without wheelchair ramps or stair lifts. Places where parked cars have been replaced with dining patios and market stalls, crowded with people walking and on bicycles. I can't dodge or dash out of the way with my cane or if I am in a wheelchair. And I can't do steep slopes or uneven pavers or broken concrete at all.
I am all for less cars and smaller roads- but the common spaces need to be planned to take into account the people who can't walk, run, or ride a bike.
I am all for less cars and smaller roads- but the common spaces need to be planned to take into account the people who can't walk, run, or ride a bike.
@EvilGinger013 @qag @Andres4NY You only contradicted me in my main point, that for most things in towns(small areas) you don't need a car. Your last sentence I mostly agree with. Only mostly, because it does not mean it has to be for cars. You, as a disabled person and others in similar situations, still need a vehicle and paths to move freely. The 2. image here shows a path that is most likely sufficient for this.
Maybe we just misunderstand each other on the basis of what defines a car.
Maybe we just misunderstand each other on the basis of what defines a car.
@SomeAnoTooter @qag @Andres4NY
There are not many ways to define "car". It's pretty simple.
And even in small towns, some of us need a car or vehicle that we can fit our wheelchairs into to get to places like *our doctor's offices*. Or do you expect us to manually push ourselves and to go up and down steep hills for miles trying to get to your pretty town square, where the offices or restaurants or shops or other services are?
I live in an area with lots of hills. I can't walk or wheelchair myself there- I *need.my.car* (an EV) to get there- once parked I can wheel or limp along the sidewalks or paths, as long as they do not have slopes I cannot get my wheelchair up. And the pavers in the second shot are a tripping hazard if I am using my cane or a rollator- smooth surfaces are safer than ones with dips and places small wheels or cane points can get caught.
I live in small town- I *DO* need my car to get places because I am not a marathoner with unending strength and stamina.
There are not many ways to define "car". It's pretty simple.
And even in small towns, some of us need a car or vehicle that we can fit our wheelchairs into to get to places like *our doctor's offices*. Or do you expect us to manually push ourselves and to go up and down steep hills for miles trying to get to your pretty town square, where the offices or restaurants or shops or other services are?
I live in an area with lots of hills. I can't walk or wheelchair myself there- I *need.my.car* (an EV) to get there- once parked I can wheel or limp along the sidewalks or paths, as long as they do not have slopes I cannot get my wheelchair up. And the pavers in the second shot are a tripping hazard if I am using my cane or a rollator- smooth surfaces are safer than ones with dips and places small wheels or cane points can get caught.
I live in small town- I *DO* need my car to get places because I am not a marathoner with unending strength and stamina.
@EvilGinger013 @qag @Andres4NY Seems like you haven't read what I wrote. I never said you don't need a vehicle(something that helps you and everyone else to move faster and more agile and for longer). I still say, towns shouldn't evolve around big streets for big cars and can and should do this without anyone being restricted to move(besides some who think they need more space than others and should have privilege to get space of 4or more other people).
Ludovic Archivist LagouardetteHey, some sass intended but are you saying that a motorized wheelchair is more expensive than a large SUV equipped for hands only driving?
A friend of mine is disabled and cannot drive. In his US city, he cannot even go to the doctor without help. Even with a motorized wheelchair, he couldn't. But in a walkable neighbourhood, he would recover most of his autonomy
Do you think cars parked on sidewalks and sign posts make for easier obstacles?
LisPi@EvilGinger013 @SomeAnoTooter @qag @Andres4NY > I need a car to get to places miles away from my home,
That's a lot more the actual problem.
Your country is using that idiotic #CarCentric development.
Turns out it's also a lot easier to build nicer accommodations for all if everything isn't ridiculously stretched out for no good reason.
Morgan ⚧️@SomeAnoTooter @EvilGinger013 you can argue for better public transit or fewer cars etc without arguing with disabled people about what accommodations we do and don't need
As it is, we seem to be going the route of getting rid of car accessible places *before* making them accessible to wheelchair users (and other mobility impaired people) in other ways. Disability accessibility should come *first,* then we can talk about getting rid of car-accessible streets
As it is, we seem to be going the route of getting rid of car accessible places *before* making them accessible to wheelchair users (and other mobility impaired people) in other ways. Disability accessibility should come *first,* then we can talk about getting rid of car-accessible streets
MJ Ray@EvilGinger013 @qag @Andres4NY there's still a roadway there for people who need it and that's good. By all means push for that to remain but please don't allow petrolheads to exploit you to block improvements of our towns.
@EvilGinger013 @qag Okay, I hadn't planned to respond to this, but since everyone else seems to want to argue with you:
1) Leave her alone, she's telling you her lived experiences.
2) Nothing she says in her toot conflicts with the "cars ruin everything" point. Cars ruin everything - including the way we gave up on accessible public transit, made destinations far apart and dangerous to get to, and removed other travel options for people. Cars (and cities designed for cars) make people need cars.
1) Leave her alone, she's telling you her lived experiences.
2) Nothing she says in her toot conflicts with the "cars ruin everything" point. Cars ruin everything - including the way we gave up on accessible public transit, made destinations far apart and dangerous to get to, and removed other travel options for people. Cars (and cities designed for cars) make people need cars.