Ben WerdmullerJun 3, 2023
There should be a non-profit accelerator for end-user open source projects that have the potential to make the world more equal, inclusive, and democratic.
Show threadBen WerdmullerJun 3, 2023

Give the people who are building tools like Mastodon:

1. Training in user-centered software design and how to make well-founded product decisions quickly
2. Training in go-to-market and business skills
3. Training in trust and safety and community management
4. A network
5. Money

Show threadBen WerdmullerJun 3, 2023
This is partially self interest because I love open source and I used to help run a mission driven accelerator, but I also deeply wish this existed. And it’s not just about building software; it’s about building communities that succeed in their aims to make the world better.
Show threadCameron MulderJun 3, 2023
@ben how much do you need to start this?
Show threadBen WerdmullerJun 3, 2023
@Mulderc To meaningfully put money behind a project I think it might be $100K per. So it depends on the number of projects and the number of people employed to support.
Show threadGaëtan PerraultJun 3, 2023

@ben @Mulderc that sounds way too small. Mastadon is already earning $35k USD / month on Patreon. That's $420k/year

You're talking about a one-time grant for like one "rich world" engineer salary. And the output of these accelerations are just more features that need to be maintained by the core team.

Now I don't object to contributing the 100k once. But if we want Mastodon to be a forever tool, It needs forever funding as well.

Get more from Mastodon on Patreon

Creating Mastodon

Patreon
Show threadKartik AgaramJun 3, 2023
@gatesvp @ben @Mulderc There should be no forever tools and no forever funding. Trying to guarantee stability in a changing world always leads to creeping bureaucracy and capture.
Show threadGaëtan Perrault

@akkartik @ben @Mulderc starving an essential tool of its resources ends up dooming its dependents and always leads to capture.

I think that we will forever need a waste treatment system and it should be funded forever. You seem to think this is a bad idea because it will lead to "creeping bureaucracy and capture".

But unless you have a better system for dealing with human waste (?) I think your premise stinks.

Jun 3, 2023 at 6:59pmWeb
Show threadKartik AgaramJun 4, 2023

@gatesvp Waste treatment is certainly way more important than Mastodon. I haven't heard that it has some sort of endowment in perpetuity. I'm not an expert, but my null hypothesis is that waste treatment is perpetually underfunded in the US while we carefully avoid ever touching say defense spending. The US govt as a whole _is_ hopelessly captured.

I don't understand your first paragraph. Perhaps you have a different definition of capture than me.

Show threadGaëtan PerraultJun 4, 2023

@akkartik look I will just quote you here, but I will replace "tools" with an actual technology.

There should be no forever {waste water system} and no forever funding. Trying to guarantee stability in a changing world always leads to creeping bureaucracy and capture

Mastodon is currently the primary tool for delivering an ActivityPub powered social network. And I think we need a publicly funded social network forever.

I'm not sure why you don't?

Show threadKartik AgaramJun 4, 2023
@gatesvp I agree we need a publicly funded social network forever. I disagree Mastodon requires forever funding. Tech is young, change is still common. The difference between proper nouns and common nouns matters.
Show threadGaëtan PerraultJun 4, 2023

@akkartik Mastodon was founded in 2016. ActivityPub is 5 years old.

If that's young, what's old to you?

If not Mastodon, then who/what do you fund forever? While still avoiding capture?

Show threadKartik AgaramJun 4, 2023

@gatesvp The idea of funding something forever is fundamentally susceptible to capture. We shouldn't have a forever funding source deciding whom to fund. As new tech arises, grow its funding gradually. If Mastodon slows, atrophy its funding gradually -- and independently.

I have zero objection to, "Mastodon is popular now, it deserves funding now." And all your statements about how much is too small, how it compares with one "rich world" engineer salary -- all that still applies.

Show threadFlorian IdelbergerJun 4, 2023
@akkartik @gatesvp you do realize that forever is not actually forever right?