Chad LoderA former San Francisco city official has allegedly been caught on camera attacking unhoused people with bear spray, calling into question his claim of being a victim. https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/27/us/san-francisco-city-official-homeless-pipe-attack-bear-spray/index.html
John@chadloder I’d be more careful. The only people alleging this so far (and being careful doing it) are his assailant’s counsel. Who are doing their duty by throwing everything out there to muddy the waters. I would not go so far as to say any of this calls his victim status into question. Whether or not his assailant (Definitely caught on video) will ultimately be deemed to be justified in beating his skull with a lead pipe is still TBD.
@jcsnotes Be more careful than what
@chadloder he hasn’t been accused by anyone other than attorneys with a clear incentive to do so. Even so, the furthest the counsel for the assailant would go was to say he “appears to be” the guy in the videos they were given. I dunno maybe I’m making a mountain out of a molehill. If he gets indicted, he’ll be accused. (And if he is the guy, he should be indicted. I also feel his assailant should be.)
nonazisformethanks@jcsnotes @chadloder John, it's not true that only the counsel for Doty accused Carmignani of bear-spraying. There is a lot of video, and putting aside journalists, an attorney from the DA's office said he expected charges to be dropped. The DA later walked that back, but this is hardly one advocate's opinion.
Carmignani skipped the court hearing after the video came out, and Doty was released from jail. And while Carmignani denies being the bear spray guy, "He acknowledged that he had confrontations 'on a regular basis' with several homeless individuals."
https://sfstandard.com/criminal-justice/don-carmignanis-alleged-attacker-released-from-jail/
@No_Nazis_Please who else is accusing him? The media reports all center on Doty’s counsel doing so (and I think they are actually being circumspect). The DA & police have had the videos for some time apparently - no charges or accusations yet. That’s my point - Doty’s counsel have a duty to point the finger - I have zero issues with that. But the authorities haven’t yet.
@jcsnotes Did you not read my entire post? An attorney with the DAs office said they would probably drop charges because of the bear spraying evidence against Carmignani. The journalists are referencing video we can all watch, and observing that it sure looks like him.
Carmignani ADMITS that he bear-sprayed Doty in this incident in response to "shouting", which is a crime right there. While he denies (to reporters) that he is the bear spray guy, he "He acknowledged that he had confrontations 'on a regular basis' with several homeless individuals."
He failed to show up at the court hearing after the bear-spraying video was released, on a thin excuse. And the only independent witness says Carmignani threatened to stab and kill Doty before anything else happened.
The real question is, why hasn't Carmignani been charged with crimes?
@No_Nazis_Please I did. It’s not clear to me that it is current. There were reports that the charges would be dropped (DC said so himself on Tuesday night on KPIX). That was walked back and the DA moved forward with a prelim yesterday. So, unclear.
At bottom, I think they are struggling with what to do. DC may be a bad guy, may get indicted, and may have provoked a confrontation. But I don’t think the DA wants to be seen as sanctioning a vigilante beating like the one he suffered.
@jcsnotes Sure, they're playing it safe (DAs are politicians, and ambitious ones at that.)
But they made it clear that charges against Doty will be dropped unless Carmignani appears in court (and testifies under oath). C. seems suddenly unwilling to do so since the bear-spraying video came out.
@No_Nazis_Please I’ll give the dude a temporary break given his condition. I don’t see this as people playing it safe. It’s a lousy situation. Both of these guys have records & have engaged in bad behavior. As I said, if you’re going to indict a guy for using a garden hose, it’s tough to think about *not* indicting a guy for using a pipe.
@jcsnotes Read the articles and look at the video. Not a pipe, more like a rod.
No jury outside of Simi Valley is going to indict a sleeping man for responding after he was woken up by a violent ex-con who serially attacked homeless people and was carrying bear spray, who threatened to stab and kill him, then bear sprayed him when the victim (Doty) started shouting.
Carmignani will be lucky if all charges on both sides are dropped (for this incident). Hopefully he'll be prosecuted for the 7 other attacks.
@No_Nazis_Please I have seen the video - they are both “ex cons” by this definition. And if the defense is “not a pipe, more like a rod” ? Good luck. Still busted his skull
@jcsnotes We know that Carmignani pled guilty to beating his wife. Where do you see that Doty is an ex convict?
@No_Nazis_Please he’s in a Louisiana domestic violence registry (ironic). Again, that’s your point - not mine. Neither of these guys bad acts are relevant to what happened in the alley