Ken WhiteMar 20, 2023
Tap-phone-to-pay subway an ease-of-use game changer. Remembering what it’s like to have a functioning transit system. Super easy to get around. Nobody doing drugs on train.
Show threadMatt LMar 20, 2023

@Popehat The London vs NYC transit comparison is really the ultimate case study in how badly America is broken.

NYC is a Liberal city in a blue state, and has far more functional independence and tax raising powers than Greater London.

Also London's city government and mayor were only created in 2000. Before that it was administered directly by the national government like DC.

NYC should easily be able spend more and solve its problems more easily.

But it doesnt and cant.

Show threadDrGeckoMar 20, 2023
@mattlav1250 @Popehat You're totally, completely and utterly wrong about NYC. The MTA, which runs our transport, answers to three states and, unlike Transport for London, has control only over most (not all) the trains and buses. Other agencies control other transport systems. NYCity itself has almost no independent taxing powers. Ultimate authority rests with the state which treats the city as an ATM and routinely raids 'dedicated' MTA funds.
Show threadMatt L

@DrGecko @Popehat I mean somewhat true, but there is A STATE of New York thats not the national government and can pass its own laws and taxes. And is, at least in theory, controlled by a liberal party.

Also, I think you're underestimating how much tax authority the city does have. NYC has its own supplemental business taxes, sales taxes and a property tax.

Greater London has nothing except a per capita grant, traffic charges and a small property tax bump.

Mar 20, 2023 at 6:18pmWeb
Show threadMatt LMar 20, 2023

@DrGecko @Popehat I agree completely about the divisions of power, responsibility etc in New York, the abusive relationship with Albany etc.

I think that was kind of my point. There are no UNDERLYING reasons why NYC should be worse than the GLA.

Its all due to the broken dysfunctional way the system is run and organised in practice.

Show threadMatt LMar 20, 2023
@DrGecko @Popehat I also just checked and, as I had thought, NYC does also have its own city income tax, additional to the state one.
Show threadDrGeckoMar 20, 2023
@mattlav1250 @Popehat The problems in NYC are (1) the transit system sprawls over multiple political jurisdictions, (2) all of which are hostile to NY. London has always had a more-or-less unified structure (London Regional Transport, London Regional Exec, etc) answerable to a single political body. This is a very common problem in America (split jurisdictions, control by distant, hostile state gov'ts).
Show threadMatt LMar 20, 2023

@DrGecko @Popehat Yes, I agree.

Which is sort of what I meant about the broken nature of American government. Endless jurisdictional conflicts, institutional sabotage, lack of unified decision making or joined up government.

Plus the absolutely corrosive and destructive effects of the campaign funding system, with its limitless possibilities for quid pro quo corruption in contracts etc.

Show threadDrGeckoMar 20, 2023
@mattlav1250 @Popehat Exactly my point - there are deep structural reason why our transportation system is so broken. It's not easy to solve, contrary to your first message here. NYC is not in control of its own transportation system. The various taxes (city income tax, property and sales taxes) are only levied with permission from the state, same as county taxes elsewhere. States are sovreign; NYC is a corporation chartered by the state and has no independent authority.
Show threadMatt LMar 20, 2023

@DrGecko @Popehat At the end of the day, I dont think you seem able grasp what my point was.

There are INDEED structural reasons why the NY area transport system does not function adequately, and they illustrate quite well the deep problems in US government.

But, and this is the point, THEY SHOULDN'T EXIST. New York isn't New Delhi. It has a huge potential tax base. Its not a structure of society or economy problem.

Its a structure of government problem.

Show threadDrGeckoMar 20, 2023
@mattlav1250 @Popehat You wrote, "Its all due to the broken dysfunctional way the system is run and organised in practice." This confused me. We both agree, I think, that it's a structure of gov't problem. That means it's not the way the system is run. It's the way the system is structured. Anyway, we do agree, I think, but also note that 'society' is part of the problem, given the multiple possibilities for graft and corruption.
Show threadMatt LMar 20, 2023

@DrGecko @Popehat I mean, I would say 'run' fits in as in, all the poor decision making, grafting corruption by mayors governors etc, inside the existing systems, not withstanding that those structurally suck.

Daniel Patrick Moynihan Train Hall for example, is a disaster of mislocated, user-hostile design that is solely about a convoluted series of political decisions, panders and intrigues.

Built over the same time frame as London's massive Crossrail system.

Show threadMatt LMar 20, 2023

@DrGecko @Popehat So we do both agree mostly, but I think even within the constrained framework NY has, they do an exceptionally poor job at working with what they've got.

And the various leaders and administrators of both city and state deserve a shower of criticism.

Show threadDrGeckoMar 20, 2023
@mattlav1250 @Popehat Oh, yes. One problem: Independent authorities like the MTA were created to be insulated from political pressure. They got things done for a while but soon ossified, became increasingly sluggish and stupid, and there's no way to change them since they were designed to be insulated from public pressure.
Show threadDrGeckoMar 20, 2023
@mattlav1250 @Popehat The grafting isn't by mayors and governors; it's by a whole parasitic class of consultants and engineers (the MTA has almost no in-house capability). At least some of the user-hostile design of the Moynihan Train Hall is political (to further immiserate the homeless), although there were other reasons, for ex. we could always use another shopping mall (eyes-roll emoji).