Please don’t confuse what is legal with what is right. There is some overlap, of course, but not as much as one might think. Laws are generally written by the rich and powerful to protect their interests, often at the expense of the poor and weak. Many atrocities are lawful, and many acts of mercy are unlawful. I say this as an attorney.

@eric Most of the truly horrific things throughout history have been entirely legal under the laws of the time.

So yes, so very true.

@eric this is how I feel about Thanksgiving and how it came to be

The fact it is still celebrated really bares badly on the soul of the world

@eric 5-0 is basically a samurai class installed to hurt the peasantry. Cities are becoming the modern day feudalist castles. The politicians at the top are vexxed with debouchery and break the law with seeming impunity.

I think the Hispanic and Black community would fair best going suburban or rual. I'd prefer the latter.

@eric And fundamentally, in a common law system, decisional law is typically a court’s balancing of the parties’ competing interests and rights. Given that for the vast majority of the common law system’s existence, certain kinds of folks had more rights than others, it’s not surprising that those biases are baked in. Stare decisis has, as a virtue, that the law is predictable. It’s worse vice is that it makes the law predictably regressive.

@eric This reminds me of a section I highlighted while reading Letter from a Birmingham Jail by Martin Luther King recently. I’d like to share it.

“We should never forget that everything Adolf Hitler did in Germany was "legal" and everything the Hungarian freedom fighters did in Hungary was "illegal." It was "illegal" to aid and comfort a Jew in Hitler's Germany. Even so, I am sure that, had I lived in Germany at the time, I would have aided and comforted my Jewish brothers.”

@eric
What is the difference between "unlawful" and "illegal"? Is it just a more formal term?
@serehfas @eric Now that's a can of worms...
@serehfas ok they are extremely similar but slightly different. I couldn’t find a good example to show difference but by definition.
Unlawful is not approved by the law but not necessarily against the law either. Seems like it means there’s no law that allows you to do it.
Illegal is a violation of the written law.
Illicit carries strong tone of immorality.
Criminal means it’s punishable
It’s all semantics and all can be punished by law.

@twitterreject Interesting, thank you.
What I am pondering is whether "Robodebt" in Australia was unlawful, because it was never conceived of that the Govt would go outside its own governing legislation, or illegal, because they did ignore their legislation.

When ppl get social security here, their entitlement is calculated week by week depending on what, if any, earnings they had. So-called Robodebt used an algorithm to average their income over 12 months then claim they got too much money.

@serehfas sounds like some shady garbage cops & gop would pull over here. We had problems with cameras at stop lights that automatically send you a ticket in the mail if you run light. They were just $ makers and are banned pretty much everywhere except a few terrible cities (solana beach, CA). They were the big thing for a minute but nearly all got ruled unconstitutional when challenged
@twitterreject
Glad to hear it, but the poor suffer because they can't afford to challenge it.
Our "Liberals" are hardline rightwing conservatives who worship Trump and the GOP.
@twitterreject Luckily they were ejected last election, but we also only have 2 real parties, so Labor got in.
They used to be a workers party, back when socialism was not a dirty word, but they have occipied the Centre Right vacated by the non-Liberals in their journey to hit the right-hand stop.
So there is nobody representing the poor and the workers, and many of Labor's policies are just a softer version of the conservatives'.
@twitterreject We have been spoilt for years with relatively consumer-friendly laws, and a degree of fairness in the justice system (unless you are First Nations, in which case an encounter with the cops can mean suffering and death, or a Person of Colour where you will get a very raw deal unless you play top level sport. Sound familiar)?
@serehfas shit the cops here don’t even care if you’re an athlete. They beat an NBA player and broke his bone and he missed the playoffs bc he was running his mouth at a cop who was rude to him. Police have roots in racism w/stopping runaway slaves. They still treat minorities like that
@serehfas yeah our democrats are similar. Even though all the progressive policies poll over 60%, the dems act like they have to be conservative and stop any progressive movements. So we have the far right conservatives and centrist dems when majority of country supports progressive policies. It’s insanely frustrating
@twitterreject We are all going mad together. That scenario is proof of State Capture; business holds sway over Govt, so the mere consituents' wishes count for nothing.
@serehfas the crazy thing is 1 man from your country has done more damage to us than any enemy we’ve ever had. The republicans love him for spewing their propaganda and the dems treat his channel like it’s harmless and legitimate news. Murdoch is our real enemy
@twitterreject That creature, Davros from Dr Who's Daleks? It's ok, we say he's a US citizen, lol. He has trashed us and the UK, just to assuage his short man syndrome, or as Thunberg put it so well recently, smalldickenergy.com.
The UK commission into his phone tapping activities heard him say he ran an entertainment network...truth is surplus.
@serehfas it’s funny bc here the “liberals” are progressive and very left wing.
@twitterreject Its all doublespeak; perhaps "newspeak" a la "1984".
@twitterreject
They ised tax records for this, which are a simmation of the whole year, not connected to eligibility.
They also required recipients to prove they didn't have a debt, where our law requires the creditor to prove debt.
They took this over longer periods than the 7 years people are legally required to keep tax records.
It was a dodgy attempt to claw back cash from the most vulnerable. There were a large number of suicides. Scandalous; now going through a Royal Commission.
@serehfas damn! The gop slashed funding to IRS (tax division) so they no longer had the resources to pursue rich people for tax fraud and started auditing poor people where they might get a couple hundred $ at most.

@twitterreject Yes, our ATO was pursuing small business. Huge corporate fraudsters get a fine which is only a % of their actual tax bill. Richard Boyle whistleblew on the practices, and is now being dragged through court for sharing classified info.

Aboriginal women with unpaid parking fines get more jail time than white collar crims.

@serehfas sounds exactly like here
@twitterreject Covid response, or lack of it, has shown how G7 plus ASEAN and others are all in lockstep.
@twitterreject Hope that's not controversial, but I like my health and I cannot believe public health principles and experience garnered since London's Cholera outbreak in the 1800s have been abandoned.
@serehfas health shouldn’t be controversial. The entire right wing made it a political issue to try to protect economy & businesses and now right wing voters listen to high school dropouts who posted a YouTube video over their own Dr’s and scientists. Trump made it political right from the start and over 300,000 deaths are attributed to his screw up
@serehfas in Jan 2020, Trump gave author Bob Woodward an interview and let him record it. He’s on record talking about how terrible he believes Covid is and worse than flu before public knew. Then in February, Trump goes on tv and says it’s no big deal. Woodward said absolutely nothing about interviews and trump comments bc he was saving it for his book, 2 years and 1 million dead people later. There’s like 5 authors who did similar w/trump scandals kept quiet for books
@serehfas the cdc wanted to send a mask & test kits to everyone but Trump stopped it. Then when states were ordering medical supplies to deal with virus, trump & Kushner had govt agents stop the deliveries and steal all the supplies. States needed covert delivery with private security to get masks and such. Trump people thought it killed minorities more so they didn’t care to stop spread. Plus they invested heavily in ivermectin and lost a fortune on it
@serehfas if we had any other president and any other attorney general leading our justice dept right now, trump would’ve gone to prison years ago. But Biden wants peace & unity and our Attorney general Garland refuses to prosecute any Republicans probably bc Biden told him not to in order to get the job. It’s a huge scandal that nobody will be punished for
@twitterreject Funny, Labor is the same. We figure they might not show up too well themselves if people start investigating. What angers me is we had it under control, then Morrison, former LNP PM, forced the issue by letting one state of our, like 5 states, have Covid run free and force it onto everyone. We voted Labor for change, but we got more of the same. Its like a football league, pick your colour, but its the same game, same goals.
@serehfas we’ve only got 2 real parties here, democrats and republicans (or gop). People try to say they are the same and in a couple ways they are, but they are opposites. The dems try to give us partial policies of what we want (ie. we want complete student loan forgiveness, they gave us $10k) while gop tries to destroy or stop any policy that is beneficial to the 99% of us and only wants perks for the rich 1% & fake religious. They are suing to block student loan forgiveness
@serehfas surprisingly our govt is usually pretty good at the things it does like post office or military or tax collecting or environmental regulations. But the gop says govt is bad at everything and that’s bc they sabotage every govt program they can so there’s always problems. They literally try to destroy everything beneficial our govt does and the dems are big pussies who let them walk all over them. Gop is 1/3rd of voters but dominate bc the dems are weak. It’s pathetic
@serehfas trump staged a failed coup and tried to take over the government and have his VP murdered. It’s been over 2 years and not a single indictment despite this happening on live tv. Biden wants to play nice with republicans so he left many in positions of power that are trying to sabotage him. Our attorney general refuses to prosecute any elected Republicans despite many crimes committed in the open and even bragged about. It’s ridiculous
@twitterreject Labor is dumb the same way. They are still using advisors who were political LNP appointments, and naively imagining they are not being undermined.
@twitterreject Is Woodward a journo? Similar happened here, can't remember the fine detail, but key info was covered up by a journo until publication.
@serehfas yeah. Woodward was a journalist for Washington Post. He got famous for his reporting on Watergate scandal that led to govt investigation & Nixon resigning. Wrote book “all the president’s men” about it. Trump was excited to be interviewed by him bc he’s famous. There’s about 5 people from trump’s inner circle that withheld info on him to put it in their books several years later. Shameless greed. It’s mindblowing the level of corruption and criminal he was daily.
@twitterreject Ah,thought I recognised the name,now I know.
@eric The Holocaust did not break any laws of Nazi Germany, while protecting Jews was illegal.

The law isn't always right!

@eric “The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal loaves of bread”

Anatole France

@eric
"The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread." - Anatole France

“When, in the course of human development, existing institutions prove inadequate to the needs of man, when they serve merely to enslave, rob, and oppress mankind, the people have the eternal right to rebel against, and overthrow, these institutions.

The mere fact that these forces inimical to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness are legalized by statute laws, sanctified by divine rights, and enforced by political power, in no way justifies their continued existence.”

That’s from 1909, by the way. 114 years ago.

“A New Declaration of Independence” by Emma Goldman

https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/A_New_Declaration_of_Independence

A New Declaration of Independence - Wikisource, the free online library

@david the funny thing about that quote, it sounds great in theory but try to apply it by rebelling against the institutions enforcing the laws and watch what happens. It’s repeated today to make people think the laws and policies we have are just and fair for everyone or else people would’ve rebelled.

@twitterreject nah, I don’t take it that way.

To me the funniest thing about that quote is the footnote that goes along with it in the book it was published in…

“This `Declaration' was written at the request of a certain newspaper, which subsequently refused to publish it, though the article was already in composition.”

We’ve all been too distracted by “stuff” to pay attention to the ruse for an incredibly long time.

@david holy shit I had no idea about that. That’s crazy. Another one like that is the claim that corporations are people came from the reporter for the Supreme Court around 1880’s. None of the justices ever said it or ruled it. But it was subsequently treated like it was precedent and referred to by justices after this as if it were a legal matter settled by the court. The idea goes back to like 1300’s or so but we’ve been screwed for nearly 150 yrs bc of a stupid reporter
@eric I find it hard to see any essential connection between the law and justice under our U.S. system of law.
@eric The holocaust was perfectly legal according to German law of the time.
@eric
and how often do the cops get to decide who’s a criminal
@eric Pratchett pointed me to think about the origin of the word "privilege"
@eric Yep. Slavery was legal. Segregation was legal. The NAZI death camps were legal. Apartheid was legal.
@eric It was legal to burn witches... That says it...
@kaascat @eric
And the US Supreme Court still thinks that jurists who thought witches should be burned at the stake are wise enough authorities about women to cite them and follow them still today.
@eric I have often said that the difference between #Australia and #Asia is that #corruption in Australia is supported by the law.
@StephenC @eric fwiw, I'm in SE Asia's "land of smiles". Corruption is so deep in the culture that even when informed of outright extortion, government officers will go out of their way to avoid holding the criminals to any accountability. They won't even file a report. My wife and I have even caught them in perjury, but the government bends over backwards to protect their own.
@Jeramee @eric I find life is better being polite about a country where you are a guest. Every country has corruption.
@Jeramee @StephenC @eric that’s exactly what out justice dept has been doing for the last 2 yrs to cover for the previous criminal president